Robin: From frostburn to sunbite. That's the name of this episode. And you'll know why when you hear what is brand new material with Jordan Liebman. Talk about that in a second. Excellent. In this episode, the one bike and the one ride which most affected your knowledge and experience. Going deep. Going deep. Window shopping with Joanne Don. No armory this round. She wants to look at bikes. And as I said before, with George Wyman's journey, brand new material from Jordan Liebman, who is now kitted out for the podcast. He's now invested. He's made the commitment. So you'll hear the sound of his incredible sultry voice. Like listening to Jessica Rabbit.

Brian: I'm not bad. I was just drawn that way. Brian, catch me up. Been a whole two weeks. Yeah. What is there to say? Tell me everything there is to tell. Yeah. So if you see this relic behind me, the shells behind me were pulled from the Titanic. And no, they came from the county courthouse in Salem, Indiana, in Washington County, Indiana. And my aunt has had it for many years. And so I dragged this thing home and did a lot of reengineering and repair and polishing and cleaning so much Murphy's oil soap. So we got this nice oak background. Looks a little more legit. Maybe I can put some law books up out there and kind of make people think I'm a serious person. I don't know.

Robin: Encyclopedia Britannica goes a long way.

Brian: Yeah. Get some of those fake books on Timu or something. Fill it up a little bit. Yeah. Getting ready to do the chain and sprockets on my Yamaha FJ09. Got about somewhere around 31,000 miles on this set of chain and sprockets. Not bad. Is that the stock one? No. Okay. The stock one was just roach. When I got the bike, the stock one was just roach. I mean, the guy sold it at the perfect time when it needed chain sprockets, tires, valve check. He's like, I'm done. Take this thing for away. And I did. Nice. I like to do all that stuff myself. So I know it's done right. I'm weird that way. Yeah. The chain and sprockets, you know, the, it's starting to show the rust, you know, the rings are failing. So you see the little red rust up here. Yeah. And it's got about 31,000 miles, which is really good. EK chains are pretty amazing. Yeah. I've always had good luck with them.

Robin: Now, is this a master link chain, a clip? What kind did you put on?

Brian: Yeah, it's a rivet link.

Robin: Okay.

Brian: And I was getting ready to put it on and realized that Yamaha requires you to install a new sprocket nut. Now a lesser mechanic would have said, I don't need that government junk and just put the old one back on, but I cannot bring myself to do that. So, uh, ordered a new sprocket nut. RevZilla has OEM parts, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Just a tiny mini rant. I'd love to be able to pick the shipping method before something goes in the U S mail, because it's going to swirl around Indianapolis like a toilet for a couple of days before it lands at my house. You know, I would pay extra money for it to ship UPS or, you know, something more, more more, something more like it might show up when it's supposed to. So hopefully it'll be here tomorrow. I also ordered a nut from a local shop, but it's not in yet. So we'll see who shows up first. Nice. I thought, I thought I had one, but it turned out to be a clutch nut. You know, happens to the best of us, right?

Robin: Yeah. Same things, you know, it's like, is this a clutch nut or is this a sprocket nut? No, Robin, that's a piece of broccoli.

Brian: Thanks. Yeah. That's weird. The other thing I wanted to mention is the road rubber rankings on TRO dot bike, go to digi tools, look for road rubber rankings and spell just like that rubber. It's all the crap. We were emailing back and forth anyway, about what, you know, what tires for, for sport touring motorcycles are on sale, et cetera. And so on. I noticed that Bridgestone just released a new T33, which is one more than the T32. So obviously 11 better. Yeah, I don't know. They claim 47% more life tread life. Yeah. And it's a bold statement. It's a bold claim under what conditions, you know, let's find out. Hey, Bridgestone, you know, where we're at. I will torture test the hell out of these. We will beat the hell out of your tires and tell you what we thought. So new tire from Bridgestone and they've got a $70 rebate offer. So they're 433 bucks a set before the rebate. Uh, so that would bring it down to 363 a set, uh, after the, if you count the rebate. So yeah, not bad. Pretty intriguing. The T32, which is one less than the T33. Somehow I, how did you come up with that? It's still available and there's a rebate. I think the rebate $60 for that. So, okay. And then there's a Michelin Michelin rebate. That'll probably be done by the time this airs. If you're thinking about slapping on some new rubber for the spring, for the summer, check it out first. I found it. I find it useful. So we keep it maintained.

Robin: Nice. Yeah. And I'm going to make some updates to it where it'll be easier to read on a mobile device. It'll be even number panel will be a slighter gray. So it's easier to determine which tire you're looking at. And there will be links to images of aftermath, which are already posted in the Google sheet. All I have to do is make it so you can actually click on it and view the destruction that was waged upon it. Is that the right word? Waged?

Brian: That was, uh, yeah. Reeked, waged. Yes. Visited.

Robin: Visited upon it. Punishment. I don't know if it's getting any traffic, but I hope it is. Probably a lot of argumentation too. What do you mean? He only got 1300 miles.

Brian: Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. I've gotten that when I've, I've mentioned it in other spaces and be like, well, what do you mean? I was like, you have not ridden with Robin.

Robin: I don't start in sixth gear and hypermile everywhere I go riding at 15 miles below the speed limit. No, I, I, I hate tires. I hate them for fun.

Brian: Full hatred. Robin, what's going on in your life? What's going on in your two wheeled world? What's happening besides pollen?

Robin: Let's see if I can make it through all this. I'm continuing the minor mods on the jigsaw. All right. I'm looking forward to putting a Fiam horn on there. I got a Fiam freeway blaster thing going on. I was going to try to put the whole component on there, but I can't find good space for it. So I have to split it apart. Use two horns in two locations.

Brian: This is the, the, the big air horn. The Jesus horn is what I call it.

Robin: No, no, no, no. Your horns, man. Come on, Brian.

Brian: Are these the ones with two round horns?

Robin: It's car horn. So it's not open speaker. It's like the one that has the tortoise shell. Yeah. I call it the Jesus horn because you hit that and you go, Jesus, what was that? Yeah. And from what I can tell, I'll be able to aim it at the ground, which will be reflective. So this should be very, that's all I'm gonna do with the bike anymore is just ride around honking just all day. Just merrrt. Gotta say, per your discussion about USPS, I managed to get the factory bags, which, what a backwards line this is. So a long time ago, we got Maggie this exact same luggage. The first generation of what SW Motec rebadges as their, I don't remember what they call it, bags. But they're expandable. They look really good. They are thermoformed. So they retain a very nice and tidy sport touring aerodynamic sort of.

Brian: So not a soft bag, but a soft-ish.

Robin: It's a soft bag. And it's also not.

Brian: Yeah.

Robin: I bought it from the country of origin. Okay. I didn't know you spoke Chinese. Yeah. Well, Suzuki rebadges these. Sells them for 550 bucks with the hardware. SW Motec rebadges these. They're Gen 2, which is pretty cool. Has SW Motec whatever bags. Same exact bag, rebadged, 550 bucks. Buy them directly through AliExpress from the country of origin, 225 bucks for the whole thing. Everything I needed. No flaws. Perfectly proper. I don't know how I feel about this. I don't know if by buying from AliExpress, did I basically finance a brand new factory of child labor in some third world nation? Did I do a bad thing by going this route? I can't bring myself to say yes to that. It was just too good to know that, yeah, this is where they're made anyhow. Go ahead and buy it. Give them the money. Take the bag. End of discussion. That's another mod that I slapped on there. I did decide to scan the bike for various types of nuts and bolts, you know, so that I could basically update the toolkit that I bring with me on trips.

Brian: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Robin: It lightened my toolkit. Two thirds of the weight gone because it's not the Beamer, but it is a chain driven bike. So I added a portable lift device for when I need to lubricate the chain. So that kind of added some weight back and bulked it back up a little bit, but at least I have it.

Brian: Yeah.

Robin: I finally got through the owner's manual. Pretty excited about that because it had some pretty cool information in it.

Brian: Did you go through? Did you memorize it? Or is this more of a Bible study sort of vibe? Today we read from the scripture of Suzuki.

Robin: I will say the washing section of the owner's manual is strangely insightful. I put this in my notes and I don't remember why, but it had a lot to do with. Don't squirt here, squirt here. Yeah, like parts that will require lubrication after a wash. I probably won't pay attention to that, but I remember seeing it and thinking, wow, that's pretty insightful. And now I will not remember any of it.

Brian: Yeah, there's a lot of that stuff most people don't think of. Yeah.

Robin: One last thing in our corrections and all that, I want to say thank you. I don't actually remember the name of this user on YouTube, but the YouTube video comment of the week, which points directly to my first go of breaking a tire bead without any equipment, but tire spoons. I don't remember the name of the user. I did go to their video channel and discovered that they have zero content whatsoever. They are logged into YouTube. They have no uploads or publicly accessible videos of any kind or shorts. Gotta say YouTube comment of the week. It is, you've never done this before and are going to show us how it's done. Okay, tool bag. Thank you very much. We are here for you, tool bag. Well, the best part is nowhere in the video do I say, going to show you how it's done. The whole time I say, I'm following instructions. I've never done this. Let's find out on video and prove the point that, hey, you can do this. But you know what? Tool bag. I'll take it. Yeah. It's like an anagram for my name.

Brian: Well, and that one's fun because you're genuinely shocked when it works. Yes. And I thought, well, that's fun.

Robin: You took it personally at first. Like, hey, you didn't believe me? On to listener questions. Got a couple of good ones here. And you are the right person to feel this first one. How do you ride on terrible roads? Word for word. Every state has them. Some roads are just awful. Like a lot of southeastern states, it's covered in potholes, massive cracks, just bad infrastructure. The almost yearly flooding usually washes roads away in some spots or sinks, and they just never recover or get fixed. What basic to upper shelf techniques do you recommend to navigate things like this? How do you ride to avoid damage slash dropping the bike on uneven pavement, holes, and things like railroad crosses and bridges where it isn't always completely flat?

Brian: Yeah. Welcome to Indiana. Welcome to New Mexico. Welcome to Wisconsin. I rode the worm. Yeah. Robin, you rode the worm. That was a bad... Actually, they kind of repaved part of the worm, but just the center. Like there was two feet in the center that had fresh, like, greasy asphalt. So you want to go first?

Robin: I eye the horizon, and using peripheral vision, I am looking for the smoothest path of travel that may not look like the perfect line if it were better pavement, but it will be the best line for that pavement. So I will look at the space between all that is worst in hopes of finding all that is as close to decent as possible, and I will keep both tires following that path. Depending on how bad it is, that will determine my speed. Then I will cross that bridge along the way. If the road just keeps going like that, going like that, I mean... So Brian talks about this short little road that we've called the worm that will never be ridden by a 777 tour again.

Brian: There's a lot of roads in that area that will never be on the 777 tour.

Robin: It was fun, though. It was fun. And I've done a lot of that. I've taken street bikes into bumpy, gravelly, slippery environments more times than I can count. Following you, Brian. Following Tim Clark. Following Travis. Just to explore. See what's out there. Have a good time. Trick is, take it slow. Stay relaxed on the controls. Don't grip. Just think about sitting on a bar stool typing an email. You can't type an email very well if your palms are leaning on the keyboard. So stay vertical. Plant your ass and all your gravity directly into the seat. Keep your elbows loose. Keep your hands loose on the controls. Look forward. Use your peripheral vision. And take it at a pace that the suspension of your machine can handle. That's my answer.

Brian: What if you punch a hole in your boot? Who do you blame then? And in different words, pretty much what Robin said, it kind of comes down to plan your line. And so basically, yeah, you need to get really good at having that vision that lets you spot the line that is the least worst option in the road ahead of you. It requires two things that you're able to plan. And then like you're able to see that and then not stare at it. Like you need to be looking at the next corner by the time you're in, you know. So when you see it, you go, okay, that's where I'm going to go. And then start planning the next one. And you need to have the precision available. So you need to have the skill available to precisely put your tire exactly where you planned on it being. Because if you can't do that in Indiana, then you can't go ride very much. Because there's a white line and then nothing. And then so every trailer on every corner pulls gravel into the road. It's just how it is here. And the same in many other states. You know, there's always crap on the road, always stuff like that. So you basically have to plan exactly what you're going to do. And then be able to do that while you're in the middle of planning the next thing. Instead of getting target fixated, staring at whatever it is that you don't want to be in or where you do want to be. So you have to have that skill of being able to place that very precisely. Exactly. Put your tires exactly where they need to be to find the best traction. That's complex. It can be. Yeah. It's something you need to practice.

Robin: Yes. I'll compliment what Brian's saying to ease the strain of hearing it. You know, the complexity matters. That's a breakdown. You're really tearing apart a single action that you should be calm while this is happening.

Brian: Yeah.

Robin: And you should see it from far enough back. If you don't see it from far enough back, then maybe that's not the pace you should have been going in the first place. I'll tell you, there are times when I'm leaned over hard and I know that the road is rough and I can feel the chatter in the front end. I can feel the back end slipping around. I can feel the dance. If it catches me off guard, that's uncomfortable as hell. But if I am aware of it and accepting of it, that's just par for the course mid-ride, assuming I know that road well enough. You know, it's when I don't know the road well enough that it like catches me and I'm like, oh, I don't like it. I don't, I don't like it, you know, but that's okay. I still don't tense up. You just respond with a little bit, use all the same techniques. You just pull a little bit of hope out of the freezer and start to thaw it out for the process as well. So this one action.

Brian: What I wrote down are three things. If we want to keep it simpler than what I was talking about is line, loose, and don't panic. So I was talking about line and so forth. Staying loose, staying loose on your controls, staying relaxed, letting the bike move around. It's normal. It's natural. The bike wants to live. You want to live. Everybody wants to live. Stay loose on it. Let it move around and don't panic because you can't see everything. Things are going to happen that are not expected. And we've talked before about keep flying the plane. And I know it's easy to say, don't panic. It's hard to do, but things are going to happen. It's going to dance around. It's going to, you know, it's going to slip and boogie around and so forth. You know, you basically, you need to keep your eyes up where you need to go, where you need to be. Stay in the throttle, maybe add some throttle to, you know, to help steer that kind of thing. Use your brains. But yeah, I had, I had a broken down line, loose, don't panic. And I can't, I can't think of an L word for the last one, but you know, this is all off the ludicrous speed. Yeah. He's gone to plaid. Go faster, man. Mr. Throttle is your friend.

Robin: I think that one of the things that we can do with this show is there are some things that we will never not say the same way, but there are some things where we'll try to make it interesting by saying it a thousand different ways. This is one of those things. Nobody likes to be caught off guard. I really can't empathize with you more than I am right here saying that. Yeah. When you are in what appeared to be perfect tarmac and the back end got away from you and you're fine, but you're not mentally, that's okay too. Like if you need to take a break and think through who, okay. Or bring it, dial it down a notch and start peeking through those corners harder. That's okay too. Yeah. Whatever is going to keep you smiling for the next ride.

Brian: Yeah. That was a very important point where part of don't panic is if you are panicking, then stop or something.

Robin: Find your way back, find your way back.

Brian: Yeah. Make, uh, make sure you have the, the mental, uh, make sure you're in the right mental place, I guess is a good, is a great way to put it. And that article I wrote on the sport touring ride leader, look for and watch for those negative emotions and deal with them, uh, because they will screw up a ride. They'll screw up your skills. You, if you're all your energy's going towards being mad or scared, then you can't enjoy your ride and you can't ride. Well, if you get spooked or something badly, then yeah. Pull over for a minute and, you know, have a drink of water, have an energy bar from Robin's, a little store, uh, you know, whatever, chew some gum, whatever merchandise and merchandise.

Robin: And, uh, I'll also say, I see what Brian's doing there. If you go to TRO'd up by click on the search icon and look for surface, just the word surface. I wrote a pretty lengthy article about that's true. Yeah. Unexpected changes in surface conditions. And it just outlines what we just talked about. You'll find your way. That's true. I forgot about that. Excellent. You ready for another one? Let's hear it. Let's do it. What's with sudden in-ride throttle issues, which was not the title of their question. More of their direct communication is kind of confused to be honest on what happened or why, but I was doing about 45, 50 miles per hour. And all of a sudden I lost all power and the bike started slowing like full throttle and it wouldn't rev or accelerate. It just idled. I sat there for a couple of minutes, putting throttle on and taking it off for nothing. I turned the bike off and started it. And then my throttle worked again. I'm confused as to why and what happened. So it's a ride by wire bike.

Brian: You want to hear some ideas? Yes. A couple of things come to mind. One that comes to mind, and I've had this happen to me. It's actually pretty famous on some motorcycles, is on your throttle and whether it's ride by wire or a cable throttle, and this is again, a fuel injection system, there's a throttle position sensor. And inside that throttle position sensor is a little, it's a coil of wire and then a little finger that kind of goes along the wire. To keep it simple, one of the things that can happen, there's wear inside there and there's particles and dust coming off of these parts because they rub together constantly as you're riding. And sometimes you can get a lot of resistance in one particular spot. If you're riding along at steady throttle, this is exactly what will happen. Your throttle position sensor will stop giving rational readings and then everything else will just stop. The fuel injection system will go like, I don't know what's going on, error, pull over and so forth. You may or may not get an error code.

Robin: Is it basically programmed to bake? If not, then just idle?

Brian: Yeah, basically, if it's not getting rational input, it doesn't know what to do. Yeah, it's basically a variable resistor. So you're getting like zero ohms all the way up to six ohms or whatever it is, I don't know. And if it's getting 0.1, 0.2, 28, 6, you know, stuff like that, you know, it may, and it may, so it may shut down the system. So what you do is you pull over, and then you work the throttle back and forth several times to kind of clean things off inside that throttle position sensor. And then you turn it back on, reboot the system, and generally you can go on for a while longer.

Robin: I can already hear like Windows ME. Yeah, exactly.

Brian: That's exactly what it does. Yeah, reboot the system. But it's a physical issue inside that sensor that is getting dirty inside, and eventually you'll need to replace that. This happens on Vstroms, like it happens to every Vstrom sooner or later. You basically, you have your input at your throttle on a throttle by wire, wherever that happens, and then it also, it has actuator, and it also has a throttle position sensor that makes sure is this positioned where the computer thinks it should be. And so if there's a mismatch there, you may or may not get an error code, it may not come up on your dash, something like that. Pull over, shut it off, maybe work the throttle back and forth a little bit, and then try again. If it keeps happening, you may have to replace one of the TPS or something like that. I don't know what bike this person had, or what system it had, whether it was throttle by wire or what. But this can even happen on carbureted bikes, believe it or not. You can actually get carburetor icing. So if you're on an old-fashioned carbureted bike, and you're going long in high humidity at a steady state on the highway, you're going 50 or 60 or 70 miles an hour, and you're not moving the throttle much, you're just kind of droning along, you can actually get ice inside the carburetor venturis. Oh, wow. So basically, the air comes in and accelerates through the carburetor, and the temperature of the air drops. And if there's enough humidity in the air, you can actually get carb icing, and it'll be a very similar thing. Once you pull over and let a heat soak a little bit, the ice will kind of melt out and fall off, and then you can go on again. Okay. And every single one of these, the solution is to pull over, work the throttle a little bit, turn it off, try again, and go on with your life. You know, it should come back. But yeah, it's very spooky when things like that happen. I'm not going to contribute fuck all to this. I've got nothing. You got nothing.

Robin: Nothing at all. Yeah, it's never happened to me before, and if it did, I'd probably be ringing you up at 2 a.m., hey, what would Brian do?

Brian: Can I use phone a friend?

Robin: If you'd like us to field your questions, please, by all means, email podcast at tro.bike, or you can visit email.tro.bike in your browser to send us a communication more anonymously, which brings us to segment one. I am looking forward to getting into this. We're going to get deep here. This is good. This is kind of a heavy thing. Philosophy. We're going to talk about feelings. The topic is the one ride and the one ride. It's sponsored by twistedroad.com, and I'll tell you what, you want to go riding on something, have a new experience, visit twisted.tro.bike. Basically, let us hook you up with a deal there. That's what I did. Yeah, man. And I'll see you soon here in New Mexico for a hella ride. Heck yeah. Brian put it out there that we should talk about, of all the bikes we've owned, which one did we learn the most from? And same goes for the first big journey we ever took. So which machine gave us the most newfound knowledge, and which journey gave us the most newfound spiritual development? Sound complex and deep and heavy and...

Brian: Yeah, man. Let's put on some smooth jazz.

Robin: Also, I'll tell you right now, anybody out there listening, we want to hear yours as well. If you feel like recording your trick of a tale to SoundCloud, visit email.tro.bike, and I'll edit it into a feature story for an upcoming episode. Just record some audio, upload it to SoundCloud, and link us. We'll make it happen. Do you want to go first? Yeah, let's start off light.

Brian: Okay. I'll start with the bike I've learned the most from, and the things I've learned. And actually, I'm going to cheat, and I have two answers for this one. But hey, are you the podcast cop or something? Come on. Anyway.

Robin: Freeze! You only get one. Damn it. Them's the rules. No rules. None. So, okay.

Brian: No rules, man. No rules. All right. The bike I've learned the most from, and I think it's probably obvious if you're someone who knows me or has known me for very long, is a 1983 Suzuki GS850G. It's blue. It's got 135, I don't know, a lot of miles on it. Yeah. Looks good from 20 feet away. I've had this bike since 1997, which is a very long time. It's been through a lot. We've been through a lot, everything there. It's the bike that has connected me with the community that has been the most meaningful of any of my life, besides perhaps family. The vintage Suzuki people and that community. Honestly, it has brought me the best friends and the best people I've ever known. Better people than I ever have met in any other way.

Robin: It puts you in that chair right across from me.

Brian: There you go. Well, yeah, of course, that's the pinnacle of existence, right?

Robin: Now, I'm small potatoes compared to some of the people we know, but the point is so many things happen as a result of the people coming together that know each other in that circle.

Brian: Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah, that's the bike. To a large degree, that's how I learned to ride on that bike, having one bike for so many years. It wasn't until... I think I didn't get a second bike in the stable until 2006, something like that. For nearly 10 years, I had one bike. That teaches you a lot about... You remove that variable from your life and you can learn so much more about the craft of riding well and things like that. This is before I took any of the courses or anything like that. I took the MSF courses and so forth, that's fine, but also riding with people who valued riding well, riding with people who valued reliability and machines. These were vintage machines, but none of us had any mercy on them. That's a little unusual in the vintage community. We rode far, we rode fast, we had a lot of really good riders I rode with and learned a lot with. I also learned that bike right now has got an engine in it that I built. I bought an engine, it was just a bare engine from some shop in Ohio that was getting rid of this engine they had in the corner for years. Took absolutely everything apart in that engine, absolutely everything. Transmission cases and rebuilt it from scratch, all new gaskets, all new everything, all the seals. That was an incredible learning experience. I was already a pretty decent mechanic, but that was an incredible learning experience to actually say, yes, I'm riding something. I have literally put every nut and bolt in this thing that's in it. I know exactly what's in there. I know exactly what it's doing. I know how much torque I put on it. I know that kind of thing. So that's been really amazing. That bike, it's like putting on your old blue jeans. Every time I ride it, I'm like, why don't I ride this old thing more? I've got other bikes. I've got more modern bikes. It's connecting me with an incredible community, incredible communities. Done so many incredible journeys on that bike and learned the most about riding. I learned about soft luggage and hard luggage, all the stuff you learn, how deep the mud is that I can go through and how deep it is that I can't, you know, all kinds of stuff like that. Ask me how I know. Yeah, really. And the second one, and this is going to be a lot briefer, but the second one I've learned the most from is the KLR 650. And that's simply because it exposed me to a whole different world of riding where dual sport riding, or if you're riding off road, the rules are all different. Okay. I thought I was a pretty decent rider. And then, and then no, you, you, you get in gravel, get on loose surfaces. You get, you know, you don't know anything, you know, took some courses, you know, did some, did some training, which really, really opened things up for me. And that bike has taught me so much that has transferred to other motorcycles. So that question about riding on terrible roads, a lot of those skills and a lot of those learnings came from having a dual sport bike, going out, getting crazy, getting loose on it, riding on gravel roads, riding in mud, going underwater. I didn't learn much from that other than don't cross water that you can't see. Anyway, snorkel. So those are the two answers. You know, the, the bike that I had, that I've had the longest and really got me started. And the second answer is the bike that got me onto dual sport riding and learn and learn so much about, uh, learn so many, it's more like skills. You learn so many skills from something like that. Nice. How about you, Mr. Mr. Dean?

Robin: Uh, I'm going to go with one answer, but it's a lot more vague. It's a lot more open and vague. My answer comes from, my answer comes from lifestyle and accessibility and availability. What I can and can't do what I can and cannot provide myself with at any given time. Every bike I've owned and I've owned my fair share at this point, you know, it's more than three, but three really stand out as having become a direct connection to my psyche and soul and physical performance. You know, the thing of it is though, not one of them stands out any more than another because it's just been time. So I can easily tell you that those three bikes are the 1982 Yamaha XS400RJ Seiko followed by the Suzuki second-generation 2003 GSF 1200S Bandit followed by the 2016 BMW R1200RS. Those three bikes, I rode them until there was no more riding for them to do. And the things I learned from each bike just arrived at the next chapter, an open book of new information that I was going to have to adapt to and try to integrate into whatever experience told me at that point. So don't turn this bolt too hard, or as you turn a wrench or the handlebars or the gas, what is being affected at the very end of that action? You know, because there's a whole mitosis of things. You turn something, anything, something is happening elsewhere all the way down to where, well, nothing more is happening. And I learned from these things. So as far as the bikes are concerned, do I feel connected to them? Yes. Are they sentient? No. They would simply become what they would become as a result of either my modifications or my riding style or mistakes that became a canvas for betterment of the machine. Oh, you screwed that up? Well, if you have to go fix that, you may as well do this doodad, which completely eliminates the need for a yada yada anyhow. And then you'll have a better bike, which is not a comfortable place to be when, you know, I didn't wrench on an engine until I got the Seiko. And now I want people to leave me the hell alone so I can wrench on my bike when the time comes. You know, it's like there's some outreach. There's a lot less than before. There's a lot of cookbook with the factory manual going on and the occasional Hail Mary or phone a friend kind of thing. But each bike got me to a new shelf in here's how you do this. And here's how you're going to go about that.

Brian: Nice.

Robin: That which I don't know is its own technique. How do I deal with that which I don't know is a big learning curve in the process of becoming a decent wrench. Now there's a second side of this whole topic here, and that's the other ride. You know, where did you go? What route did you take? How did it change your life and all the other heavy duty psychological nonsense that we're getting into again? I don't have an answer, but I think there are three in specific, but no, that's not fair. They're the ones that are the most dramatic and they're the ones that matter. But I take them for granted. I think you hit the nail on the head with those places where we've met our closest, nearest, dearest chosen family. But there have also been three separate family memorials. Sometimes the journey has to be the destination. It's personal time. It's a moment in your life, a snapshot in time that belongs to you and you alone. You have no choice. The journey itself will be your destination. They are the ones that have affected me the most. I look back at the ones that stand out as my favorite when I was happiest or the darkest when I was saddest. Those are the ones that stand out because of the peak moments in self-control to stay sane on a machine that is made of fuel in your crotch with a fire under it.

Brian: Pay attention. Yes. Stay alert. No matter how, no matter what. Yeah. And the thing is, you didn't get specific about, I know of some, some very significant rides and so forth.

Robin: Well, if we want to get exciting, if we want to get heavy, I'll give you one that is probably the most, uh, whatever you want to call it just for your entertainment. Cause I already went through it and it was already done and did on the very first bike I ever owned, which was that Seica 400. Actually, the first bike I ever owned was sold to me by Jordan. Yeah. You mentioned that. Yeah. CB500T, but the first bike that I ever had faith in, sorry, Jordan, the Seica, I was riding as best as I could for where I was from Chicago, Illinois to Sarasota, Florida on the dime I had at that time. I was trying to get to my dad in Sarasota. He was not well, he had pancreatic cancer. And when I got to my hometown of Columbus, Ohio, which was close enough to my sister and some family members there, I received a phone call. I spoke with my father for the very last time on my first motorcycle trying to get to him. And we both knew that he was going to die. And we both laughed and laughed and laughed for 15 or 20 minutes. And then very loudly told each other that we love each other. And then my step-mom, lovely woman, brilliant, just an amazing person. She got on the line and said he was going to go, it was going to be time. And I very happily owed it to her. That time belongs to her. It is not mine. My life is moving forward. Her life is at a standstill and she's about to lose. I was like, yes, you take the baton. He's heard everything he needs to hear. Why don't you call me back when everything is set up? And that's the story. Wow. That's a cool bike. The context.

Brian: So anyway, I got 40 miles to the gallon. You're in that emotional place and the bike can be part of the healing too. It centers you and pulls you into something real. You can have a lot of huge sunsets on a motorcycle.

Robin: Absolutely. You know what I'm saying? Oh yeah. Big sunsets.

Brian: It'll happen. Well, we've talked about before. Well, it was an article I wrote where I mentioned the hierarchy of needs and so forth. The cure for no time to ride article on TRO.bike. Still in the top 10 newest articles.

Robin: So I keep having to see that damn thing. And I know it. Damn it, Brian. I got to outdo you.

Brian: But yeah, one of the things we put in there was motorcycle. There's the top of the peak where there's actualization. And actually later on, he added another triangle at the top called transcendence. Motorcycles, if you're doing it right, gives you access to transcendence in a way that very few things can. They give you access to a state of mind and flow that you, I don't know any other way to get there. You know, uh, that's, that's legal anyway. You know, that's my access to it and so forth. So excellent, excellent answer. Are you ready? Are you ready for my answer? Oh, about the ride. Yeah. Bring it. I'm going to be a little vague here. Oh no. I thought I did that already. But basically there was a horrible, horrible incident. I had the absolute honor of helping bring a friend of mine back to motorcycling, back to the activity that he loved and helping reconnect him with that. Even though there was a horrible, horrible incident involving motorcycles and as bad as it gets, and I'm not going to be any more specific than that. After time and healing and so forth, he wasn't sure he wanted to come back. He felt the desires like, I want to ride motorcycles again. You know, I need some more of that heroin. And you know, it's kind of, and he felt guilty about that. And in secret, he bought a new motorcycle. He bought another motorcycle, not a new one. But it's so funny. Like he's almost sneaking around, like in secret, he bought this motorcycle, wasn't sure. And then, so we make a plan and, and so a couple of us get together. He shows up and my task was to take him for a ride, to go for a ride for the day. And this would help determine it. How does he really feel about motorcycling? Is this important enough? Is this something that he wants to do going forward, you know, and dealing with all these complex things, you know, the, the, the, what happened during the incident, what the aftermath of that, you know, there's so much riding on one day. And so, and again, he's, you know, he's, he's still healing physically as well as mentally.

Robin: I'm picturing like a bank vault, like somebody's trying to crack it. The tumblers are falling into place and realigning with opening that door again.

Brian: Yeah, a little bit. Like, it was like, I really like, you know, I've planned a lot of rides. I've planned, I've, I've not planned a lot of rides, just go ride and see what happens. Yeah. And this one here, I really, I really like, I want to show this guy, this, this close friend of mine, a really good friend of mine. I want to show him the best day on a motorcycle possible. And again, we had to keep the mileage down to around 200, you know, couldn't. So Brian took him to the worm. No, we, yeah, we did not go to the worm. I wouldn't put that in. So we, yeah, we didn't, we didn't go to the worm, but we did some, we did some worm-ish roads, you know, but, uh, and yeah, it is a beautiful, beautiful spring day in Indiana. Uh, we went on our ride. I hit every highlight I could think of. I mean, this was a complete, there might've been a nine out of 10 in a day, but it was complete as you know, the best route I could put together, you know, a great breakfast, a great lunch, you know, we had a great. I mean, I was, I put everything into this because I knew part of the process of recovery from trauma, you have to build new memories. You have to, it's like a bad piece of videotape. You have to write over that and write over that. And the more you can cover that over, the more they can bury those memories and good memories, the more you can get back to your mental state.

Robin: Some experiences need to be a breath.

Brian: Yeah.

Robin: Just an inhale. Just, it's just oxygen.

Brian: Yeah. Like I said, it's an honor. It was almost a holy day at, which I hate to use that word. I'm not religious, but ultimately it was very successful. Yes.

Robin: Did he get a knee down that day? Cause if so, it lines up. It plays.

Brian: Didn't get a knee down so to speak, but yeah, he did. And it kind of like, okay. Yeah. He was kind of like, yes, this is what I need to do. And we went riding a couple of weeks ago. It's been a positive and wonderful part of all our lives. And these are some of the people that I am the closest to in the world. It was just a couple hundred miles from my house. It wasn't blah, blah, blah, day ride. But it was the most significant ride I think I've ever been a part of. I had a responsibility that day, I thought.

Robin: You took on a role of servitude and you delivered on that role. I think I did, yeah. That's hugely important.

Brian: It worked. You're still riding bikes.

Robin: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Brian: They found their balance again, thanks to you. That's heavy. Partially part to me. It was an amazing day.

Robin: Yeah. That person's still here to continue on with new tales. This is incredible. How come I don't get that?

Brian: I've got other significant rides, but that's the most significant. That's the most, that's the big one. Yeah.

Robin: But this is two people who host this show. You have had huge experiences on two wheels that we were happy to share. If you're happy to hear it, good. If you're not happy to hear it, fine. But I'll tell you what. We would love to hear yours. The trick though, you have to record it on your own. You need to upload the audio to SoundCloud and then email us, podcast.tiro.bike, or go to email.tiro.bike and send us a message with the link to your recording. I'll polish it up and turn it into something for us to use. Preferably we'd record that at 24-bit, 48 hertz. And mono, please. With no audio activation. Passive mic, please.

Brian: Yeah. I would love to hear some of those. That'd be really interesting discussions, I think.

Robin: Hello, Joanne. How are you?

Joanne: I'm great, all things considered. I am dry. It's raining and snowing here, so I'm inside. That's great.

Brian: I ate today. I have an indoor toilet.

Joanne: I have food. I do have groceries. I've got things to be grateful for, and I'm trying very hard to focus on them and not wallow in my misery, because it's not as miserable as others. So anyways, I'll be better when it's 80 again. It's coming. I know, next week.

Brian: Yeah, we had tornadoes come through here in Indiana last night. Oh, God.

Joanne: Why do you live there, Brian?

Brian: Tornadoes. I just, I don't understand. We had 70 to 90 mile an hour winds. No. Tornado hit Carmel. That's crazy.

Joanne: Unacceptable.

Brian: Impossible.

Robin: Very good. Very good. I've got you set up for what is your open opportunity to just speak your mind and have a good time hanging with us for good content. We're not doing an armory this round, folks, because we don't have to. We can do whatever we want.

Joanne: I mean, if there's questions to be answered, I'm always thrilled to answer them, but I don't have any questions. I guess I thought I would just share what I'm working on right now, which is...

Robin: We're calling it window shopping.

Joanne: Well, I, you know, kind of window shopping. I mean, it's something we've been talking about, my husband and I, for like six months. You know, we've been talking about this for a while. It's not like it's something new, but...

Robin: Well, I mean, we're looking at bikes. Is that okay? Of course it is.

Joanne: It is. I've had this XT250 for almost two years. It'll be two years in March. Is that right? Yeah. Wow. Time certainly flies. And, you know, I figured a few years down the line, I'd probably maybe get something else. I wasn't sure, but all I knew at the time was that I wanted to definitely start there. That's what I was really sure about. So that's why I hung on to it for so long, because I'm, you know...

Robin: I'm ready to, like, crack a new tab and start just looking at Google images for whatever you say.

Joanne: Well, actually, really, there's only two options that I'm really considering, and that's the CFMoto 450 Ibex.

Brian: Oh, yes.

Joanne: The 450 Ibex.

Brian: Yeah. I got to sit on one of those. Yeah.

Joanne: And then, of course, the Himalayans alternate 450. I've sat on... I mean, I've ridden some of the classics, like way back when they were introduced, reintroduced to the U.S. So I've ridden, of course, and they're great. And I've sat on some of the 650s. But the 450 Himalayan is really the only other true apples-to-apple competitor, in my opinion, with an Ibex.

Robin: Are they both 16-19?

Joanne: I think full 21 front.

Robin: Okay.

Joanne: Yeah. Ibex is, like, not playing around. I want to say that Ibex is basically a small tenere. It's just really, honestly, I think the beefier version of what I have, like a logical step-up that's, you know, more road-ready, but still has some good average off-road capability and, you know, some modern convenience. Yeah. And a 400. I don't see any negatives to it, to be honest. But when I... You know, we've been watching stuff about it for months now, because everyone's been talking about it since last year.

Brian: Dork on the Road just got one.

Joanne: Right? I mean, we saw all of his videos and other people, too. I mean, Australia, Asia, they've had it. So there are people doing reviews over there. Yeah, I've seen some people, like, drag both of those bikes through the mud, like the CF Moto through some really hard single track, you know, stuff that it wasn't really designed for. But they're like, let's see what this can do, or let's see how...

Robin: Put it to the test.

Joanne: Yeah, exactly. And, you know, and the reviews are good. The debate is not really like, oh, are these bikes even good? I think that's established that they're both very good choices for people. And you basically just pick the one that works for you, that you can't go wrong with either one. And that for one person, the Himalayan's great. But for another person, it might be the Ibex. Just like any other bike comparisons you're doing, right? So that's really not the thing. It's really just, when can I do this? I'm hoping I get a job soon, and that would really help me. So I can't really do anything. But I'm very worried about prices changing next year. And I'm just hoping it's something I can do in the next three to four months. We'll see. I don't know. I mean, it's not going to be the end of the world if I don't.

Robin: Well, cross-referencing, what's the price comparison between the Himalayan and the Ibex?

Joanne: The Himalayan is about $800 less. It's like $58 or $57. And then Ibex is like $65 MSRP. Here, we're talking before out the door, before stuff, just straight sticker MSRP. And the good news is, as I just kind of poked around, like Colorado dealers, at least they're not playing a markup game and trying to charge $10,000, you know?

Brian: Yeah.

Joanne: Ridiculous prices for them. However, I mean, that's what's advertised. And we know when you walk into places, prices can be different. Yes.

Robin: We talked about that. Listeners, when you go to a dealership, have your OTD in place, out the door. If you can't do more than that, they have to adjust to you. It's to your benefit to have that in mind.

Joanne: Yeah. Google, you know, look at like four dealerships to see what they're all doing. But I'm not even there yet, to be honest. I know that whenever I feel like I can trade mine in and, you know, have enough to cover the rest, that I do need to test ride these. I'm not just going to take just the videos worth it, but I do want to test ride both of them. Because I've only sat on them.

Brian: Just to answer a question Robin had, the Ibex has a 21-inch front, 18-inch rear. 18-inch rear? Yeah. There's a lot more off-road rubber available in 18-inch rears. And the Himalayan is 21-17. I'm learning. Yeah. So you can still get like KLR rubber on it, but yeah. Well, I don't know what size it takes.

Joanne: I feel like the Ibex is more of a rally beef. And when I sat on it, it was comfy. A little more power, which is nice.

Brian: More power is always good.

Joanne: The modernity. I'm a modern girl. I'm attracted aesthetically to more modern motorcycles. It's just kind of my, what I like. It's all going to come down to when and if I can test ride them both and how I feel on it.

Robin: Some unsolicited information from my meager perspective on both right now, face value. I see the Himalayan, which I've sat on several times. It's less money. Okay. That's one thing, whether it matters or not. But I also see that it is more accessible on the maintenance side. It has a round headlight, which is easier to generically replace. It's been around longer, I guess. I don't know. Maybe. It looks a lot more basic at the handlebars, probably seven eights. There are a lot of things about this that you could buy at a hardware store. You know what I mean? So no harm, no foul. Whereas the Ibex, it's got a lot more modern activity going on visually with the whole, like, I'm wondering if those headlights are LEDs. It does have USD suspension. You're getting maybe more bang for the buck. That's me. I'm out. The rest of the conversation belongs to you.

Joanne: I want to say the suspension is also better. Please correct me if I'm wrong. But I want to say the suspension is a little better on the Ibex. That's the price point. And I think that speaks to its capabilities and kind of orientation, that it's more somebody who's going to do some true 50-50, whereas the Himalayan is more focused on someone who's maybe more 70-30 road to dirt or very easy 50-50. I mean, I'm going to be an easy 50-50. I'm looking for boring gravel. You know, maybe a little bit of rut, but I'm not, like, out there hardcore. I just want to sightsee. Like, I want to see stuff. I don't want to break myself doing it.

Brian: Yeah. What about things like the seat height? You're famous for being short. No, a famed short person. What's your take on that?

Joanne: I've ridden bikes with higher seat heights. For me, generally, I don't really worry about the seat height as much, except with larger displacement adventure bikes, because I don't have experience with, say, a 1200 GS or something. Like, that's where I might get a little iffy, but I'm not even there yet.

Robin: How's your fancy start?

Joanne: How what? What does that mean?

Robin: That's where you stand next to the bike, put one foot on the peg, get it going, and step over and ride, kick ass, and then come back and stop off.

Joanne: It's decent, but I don't have to do it. The Yamaha is so skinny, and the suspension is so soft, that height is not an issue. For any of you who are 5'2 or 5'1, you don't want to focus on the number. What you need to focus on is the suspension and the ergonomics. For me, both of those options, CFMoto especially, the Ergos really facilitate someone who is smaller stature, because the tank shape, the seat shape, the fact that it's a twin.

Robin: Oh, we both know where this is going. You want it. You want the Ibex. You got yours.

Joanne: I mean, screw the Ibex.

Brian: The Ibex has more power, end of story.

Joanne: I mean, probably, but I do want a test ride. That, to me, makes a huge difference. But even with the Himalayan, I'm not worried. Anything small displacement with a higher seat height is always the better choice, in my opinion, than something with a lower seat height and a higher displacement, like a cruising.

Robin: I'll bet hard money that the Himalayan is heavier.

Joanne: It probably is a little heavier. It's like sub 400 on the Ibex dry, and I'm used to that weight. And when I sat on it, it wasn't a big deal. But yeah, I'm not, I really wasn't worried, right? If it's one cylinder, then it's even skinnier. So anytime I'm riding something with less than four cylinders, I'm usually very comfortable. I've always adopted the scale over height. That's really where you compensate for lack of height and experience, right? So yeah, either one is great. And they're both good for anybody who is of smaller stature, because they are smaller displacements. They're not like riding a, you know, 300 KTM EXC or XCF that's fully for a different kind of riding with like a 39 inch seat height. So these are much more friendly. So I'm not worried about any of those things, really. It's really affording it.

Brian: I got to say the blue Ibex is dead sexy.

Joanne: It's cool. It is really cool. I like the 80s colors are really lovely.

Brian: I actually got the chance to see one in person and sit on it and bounce around, you know, at the Indianapolis Motorcycle Expo, blah, blah, blah. It's really striking. Like this is the first Chinese bike where I've been like this, this is on par. Everything is there. All the quality is there.

Joanne: Three cheers for CFMoto, because they have a very strong dealer network, because they also do a ton of side-by-sides. Like they're one of their core, right, vehicle for people who are, yeah, who have farms or, you know, are doing four-wheeling. So that's why they're such a strong brand. And it's really important to note that, that just because they're manufactured overseas, that doesn't mean anything so much as how are they established here?

Robin: We live on a one-sided object.

Joanne: Right. And they have a strong network. I mean, you look in every major city, you look in some of the smaller ones and you're going to find all these CFMoto dealers because of farm equipment side-by-sides.

Brian: Well, there's utility side-by-sides, there's UTVs, and then there's side-by-sides you zoom around on. Yeah.

Joanne: Yes. So they're strong there. I have lots of faith in their branding and ability and they're very successful. They're doing really well here from what everything I've read. I know that that's kind of the direction I'm going in, but I just got to wait a little bit.

Robin: Well, you have a bike, you have ideas, and opportunities tend to find us as time goes on.

Joanne: Very true. And luckily I have all the clothing I need to wear for it. So I'm good there too.

Robin: Similar banter at higher revs can be heard via the Gear Chick podcast. Visit GearChick.com. Let's go ahead and move on to Segment 3, Moments in Motorcycle History with Jordan Liebman. Jordan is now fully kitted out for recording, meaning he bought into the Gizmotrons and is ready to unveil the smooth, sultry audio massage that is his, wait a minute. Truth is, we finally used up his previous sit-down, so I got the chance to kick back with him once again. And wow, is the George Wyman journey getting crazy. We're heading into a multi-misspelled town to be overcharged for multi-misspelled fuel, hopefully keeping our ears warm enough to not break off of our skull like ice cubes, only to get an impressive afternoon sunburn all in one leg of the route. Let's do this.

Jordan: And here we are. So George was in Elko, Nevada. Elko was at the time, it was a division town. These are all division towns because he's basically following the railroad. At this point, it's Union Pacific. Later on, it becomes Southern Pacific. They keep changing the name, but this is where he's at. And so he's in Northeast Nevada, and he wakes up in a town called Wells, Nevada on Saturday, May 23rd, 1903. And it's basically a medium-sized town built around and in support of a rail hub. And he rode 86 miles the day before in Wells, which is a fairly decent-sized town. He stopped at a hotel, and for 50 cents, he ate like a king. And he couldn't believe how much food they gave him. And he notes that there was an option they offered for 75 cents. They called it the Gorge Yourself option, which he couldn't even imagine what that would look like. He pretty much filled it for 75 cents, which is three times the daily normal price, but still for 50 cents, actually. But yeah, he really enjoyed himself there. He filled up on gasoline in Elko. It's spelled G-A-S-O-L-E-N-E because they hadn't even really standardized the spelling of it yet. For $1.25 per gallon, which is robbery. I think the reason for that, he's about to get out in the middle of nowhere where there isn't going to be gas. Basically, they do it because they can't charge that ridiculous price. So that's more than three times the regular going price for gas. And when he crosses Illinois, it's literally like a tenth of that. So price of gas is up and down, but he has to pay it because he's got to get from Nevada across Utah and on. Wells, Nevada is still there today and is just west of Route 93 on Route 80 in northeast Nevada, close to what we're calling the gateway of the high plains, or as he calls it, the Great American Desert. So he's about to be far away from everything. He's already begun to see the difficulty he would be facing, having nearly died after he crashed the day before in a washout. So imagine it isn't even a road. It's just dirt or sand and salt or whatever. It's May. He is about to cross the mountains over here. The weather at night gets really freaking cold and during the day, it can get pretty freaking hot. He's just west of what is now Route 93 along Route 80, because Route 80 and 93 did not exist back then. So he's already starting to see the big difficulty he was about to face, having nearly died after he crashed the day before in a washout. Basically, it was just the road used to be there, and now it's just a big, slick puddle where it was once navigable ground. The ground was opened up and backfilled with rocks and mud and deep water in the process, and he broke his watch. Now he doesn't know what time it is. Sprained his back and tore a, quote, bloody chunk out of his finger. But somehow the bike was unhurt. Testimony for the California Motorcycle Company. In Wells, which was once a dwindling town that was almost a ghost town and then had a revival because of the railroad and became a boot time with over 400 people and a lot of buildings there. He cleans up his bike, does some basic tuning, tightening his spokes, which were always working loose, and he gets on his way. He leaves Wells, Nevada at six o'clock in the morning. He gets on his way, and the road, quotation marks, close quotation mark, opens up, and he begins to see convoys of what he calls prairie schooners, which are wagons that are built for rough terrain and heavy freight coming out of the east. And they're 11 foot high, they're 18 foot long, and they're like Conestogas, if you remember those from the Western movies. You know, they're covered in canvas, and there are people coming west, right? So he's coming across their path. They're pulled by four to six horses at a time, and each Conestoga can carry up to six tons of freight. They're serious, and they're built for going over rough terrain, and they're effectively the equivalent of a horse-run tractor trailer, the semis of the planes, basically. And they're meant to go all the way to California. And he says that these are carryovers, the people that are using these are carryovers from the days of the minor 49ers, and now they're used by traveling migratory farmers and religious groups and what he calls Romani people, aka gypsies, which were at the time considered to be from Romania, which was a vague area someplace in Europe, and rovers and people seeking a new start out west. There was no PC back then. It was absolutely, you know, off the cuff. So he leaves Wells at 6 a.m., and he gets along his way on. The road opens up, and he begins to see convoys of prairie schooners, and he continues along the central Pacific rails, which were completed in 1869, and he's traveling roughly northeasterly. He gets to a town called Fenelon, Nevada, which also went by the name Otigo, which sounds vaguely Native American, and which is now a ghost town, and it had only 10 inhabitants by 1941, but tells a story of how the railroad route, previously known as the Transcontinental Line and the Overland Route and the Ogden Gateway and the Dining Cart Route and the California Trail, determined whether a town lived or died back then. But Fenelon was considered an important railroad town along the way, and it was actually considered among the possibility for being in the National Historic Places back in the early 80s. I did a little research. There was a team that accumulated information from numerous sources, including 200 boxes of documents, maps, and receipts from the railroads and the Railroad Museum in Reno, Historical Society, and they have one photo of the town, which is from 1912, that survives. So there's only one photo of this town called Fenelon that they have that was an important railroad place. But he goes through this town, and he says that early occupation was by Chinese workers who were considered to be dependable and industrious, but also expendable, and later occupation was by Greek and Italian workers. The track was frequently rebuilt and moved and often abandoned, so towns along the way tied their prosperity to the railroads. But this is a stop in Fenelon, and it's one of the last stops in Nevada. So he rides from Fenelon eastward towards Utah, and on the way, the weather becomes bitterly cold. This is what we're talking about. So he started at six o'clock in the morning at the northeast corner of Nevada. I don't know how prepared he was to be warm or to cool off or whatever, but he said it was bitterly cold. He's got to make some time, and he feels his ears start to crack. So you can imagine frostbite setting in, and his solution to prevent his ears from cracking was he gets motor oil and rubs it on his ears to keep him from splitting in half. Desperate measures, right? The day moves on. He's still in northeast Nevada, still trying to make time, and by the time the sun comes up, it starts to get hot. And by the end of the day, he is severely sunburned. This is one day to keep his ears from splitting in half, ends up with a sunburn. We're lucky these days with our heated this and that and our jackets that have ventilation and helmets with ventilation and louvers on our fairings that direct air towards us. So this was a different time. He makes it to a town called Terrace, which now in 2025 is demarked as an obsolete stop on the old railroad grade road. You can Google it. Terrace, Nevada almost doesn't exist. It's been bypassed. So a lot of these towns he's going through, he's calling them towns, division towns or whatnot, literally don't exist anymore because the railroad found a better way. Once the railroad moves, the town is doomed. He goes on to Tacoma, which is still in Nevada, where he sees a wagon train of Conestoga wagons and where he gets to where he thought he saw them. Now he's frozen and he's been sunburned. Now he's seeing a wagon train of Conestoga wagons coming his way and he gets to where they were and they're not there. That's when he realized he's probably got heat stroke and he's been hallucinating. This is what's going on with this guy. What he does see along the way are what he calls dugouts, basically log houses made from railroad ties, but they usually would have one side dug into the ground, which is like half buried underground for weather, and they would have a natural half wall with one eight foot ceiling and it's sealed on the outside with mud. He says they're generally occupied by foreigners, which if you're following the railroad are probably Irish, Chinese, Italian, Greek, gypsies, Mexicans, or whatever. These are basically the people that were doing the jobs that nobody else could or would do. He said that sometimes they're occupied by Indians of the, quote, blanket type who live in them, but don't stay in them and calls them aborigine stranglers or aborigine stragglers from the reservations. But for the most part, they use teepees when they make camp. And he says that the Indian, now this is not me, so caveat, but he says, this is 1903, the Indians are lazy and mostly sulk while their women do all of the hard work. And he avoids them, but he only has words with them when he's asking for direction. Otherwise he avoids them completely. So that's his opinion of the Indians. But we weren't much better in the 50s and the 60s with our Cowboys and Indians movies. But that was 1903 and that was his opinion and that's how that worked out. So he stops in Terrace, which is one of the first towns, last towns on the Nevada side, and he makes camp and then it rains all night. We have a situation, I'm not sure exactly where the Rocky Mountains, you know, they have what they call a rain shadow. So the winds from the West come and they hit the Rocky Mountains and you get all the humidity built up on the left side, on the West side of those mountains and the rain precipitates before the peaks and the wind continues after. So it's probably at this time a season when at certain times of the day you're going to get nailed. So you get this at night sometimes even in the Midwest with a convection and whatnot, humidity. So it rains all night long. Sunday morning at 5, 10 a.m. after camping, he actually camped there in Terrace, he gets up and he makes it to another division town called Zenda. And I looked up Zenda and I can't find anything about it. Possible he got the name wrong, but I doubt it with a name like Zenda, it probably just vanished. And I expect it wouldn't have been far from Terrace or between Terrace and Ogden, Utah, which he's heading to next. I actually have a friend who is an authority on railroad history and he gave me links to a bunch of historical railroad maps from Union Pacific, but they're low resolution. So I can't make out where this town of Zenda would have been in 1903. They say that they're not for commercial use, but you can buy these maps in high resolution. So until I decide that I really want to get really in this rabbit hole here, we're just going to assume Zenda doesn't exist anymore. And it was a stop on the way to Ogden. But anyways, and this is another 5, 10 in the morning start west of the Rockies. So it's very likely he's freezing his ass off. He makes pretty good time and he gets to Ogden, Utah, which is a big town. In 1903, he says there were 15,000 inhabitants, which is a big town. There are plenty of stores and he buys himself a new map of the area that he's about to cross because he doesn't have maps of everything. He'd really rather have the best, most current stuff. So in Ogden, he gets a map and it says that he is 833 miles east of San Francisco. But by his calculations, even though he's already broken two cyclometers, that he's gone 925 miles so far. So basically, with getting lost and dropping things and having to backtrack to pick them up like that oil can, he's gone almost an entire 100 miles extra to get to this point. He says, you know, it's possible the map wasn't 100% accurate about the distance to San Francisco. You know, the roads and routes changed. I mean, there's really no roads. So maybe 833 miles by rail because they blew up a giant rock and went straight through it instead of, you know, the guy that went on the back of a horse and went the route that followed the river or something. So anyways, he likes the town of Ogden so much that he spends the entire day there. There's shops and he buys himself two new tires, one of which he mails to himself in Omaha, Nebraska in his own name, which he plans on picking up later. But it's 10 new spokes, a gallon of oil and a new belt rim, which we discussed previously is this wooden rim that fits to the rear. It basically drives the rear wheel and a new handlebar because the one he's been riding with for the last 500 or so miles was snapped in half and it's being held together by what he calls tire tape and a piece of wood held to the other half of the handlebar by what he's calling tire tape. Tires were $2.75 each for a total of $5.50 and the oil was $1.50 for a gallon. Basically, he spent seven bucks. So this is interesting. Ogden, he meets at the LH Beechcraft Bicycle Store. He meets a machinist and motorcycle hobbyist named S.C. Higgins or maybe J.C. Higgins, I think he might got that wrong, who previously built himself his own motorcycle. So he's a machinist and they get it on pretty well. But at the time of the meeting, he was riding an Indian. Indian was a two-year-old company at that time. And he invites him to sleep at his house that evening. He's in Ogden, Utah. It's a fantastic town. Why not spend the entire day there? He does that. He gets his bike all fettled and spends a day with this guy, S.C. Higgins, but it might be J.C. Higgins. And if you read the Sears catalog, J.C. Higgins was a big deal. If I'm not mistaken, and I may be mistaken, and like I said, I may be right, I may be wrong, I may be full of shit, but I will speak my mind. He is the founder of a company that you may have heard of called Ace Henderson. He runs into this dude and they hang out for the day. He goes to his house, sleeps there, and has meals and drinks and whatever. He doesn't drink, but that's Ogden. So basically that covered Ogden, Utah, the Weber River, the Weber Canyon, Devil's Gate, Devil's Slide. These are actually geological formations that you may have seen. Echo City, Echo Gorge, and Evanston, Wyoming. There's so much cool stuff going on on this guy's trip. He literally gets to camp out at the house of the guy who invented Ace Henderson, big competitors, owned by Schwinn, to Indian and Harley. He doesn't mention it because it wasn't that big of a deal yet. Here's the thing. He literally was the guy that put guns, bicycles, and motorcycles in the Sears catalog. This is 1903, so how old is the Sears catalog then? I don't know. It's crazy, the people that he's running into. Once he starts getting out of Utah, he's on the tail of Teddy Roosevelt, who is going across the country doing his campaigning on the back of a train. He shows up in town and he's like, there's no place to stay. It's Teddy Roosevelt.

Robin: Crazy. Crazy. Just crazy. 10 times the price for fuel in Erko, Nevada, because opportunism. Oh, yeah. They spell it gasoline with two E's.

Brian: Yeah, you had to go buy it in gallon jugs at the hardware store or the drugstore. You couldn't just pump it in some places. I wonder if we're going to get to that point someday. The next few breakthroughs in batteries and then suddenly everybody, we're going to, well, I need to go buy some gasoline for my old motorcycle.

Robin: It makes noise. It stinks. We've gotten through a lot. We talked about the first bike that really inspired us, the first journey that really inspired us. You're invited to bring your story, if you would like to, right here, right now. The first bike you had that you learned the most from?

Joanne: SV650S.

Robin: Boom. Which generation?

Joanne: It was a half fare. It was 2003, so it was in between. It was the in-between. It was like the 03-04 version where it was only half fare, like faring all the way down to the belly. It was- Well, that was an option. Yeah, the one I got didn't have that.

Robin: Bikini and a half, and then that, it was square tube frame, right? And injected.

Joanne: The fuel injected, yep. And yeah, it was like the first gen after the body change, like 03 is when they modified the look and feel of it. So I had an S model, bone stock, everything was stock on it. I think I did get new tires. As soon as I bought it, because I got it with 600 miles on it in 09. I bought it in 09, and the guy had it for six years. It was brand new and only had 580 miles on it.

Robin: And did you take that on any epic journey that was the most important to you of all the motorcycle journeys you've done?

Joanne: Yeah, absolutely. It was the first bike I did any actual touring on outside of San Francisco to LA. So it was the first bike I did track days on. It was the first bike I did the most miles I'd ever done. I did like a 420 mile day ride on that, which I regret. That was painful. But it was the one I did the most on. Like I went on so many solo trips. I just did so much on that bike. And it was the first bike I rode, sporty bike I rode, that just felt like this was made for me. And I put about 6,000 miles on it in six months. Damn! Yeah, because it was such a good match.

Brian: That's when you know it's right.

Joanne: Exactly. Because before I had that bike, I had a 2006 Z750S, which is a Cowie. That was when they attempted to bring in a mid-weight naked tour, and it failed horribly. So it was only here for like two years. And that bike is completely different from the SV.

Robin: It's crazy that Kawasaki just gets away with that shit too. They're all right no matter what.

Joanne: I mean, in Europe, it was doing really well. So it was already there and it was popular, but the US wasn't ready for it. And it just wasn't great. It wasn't sporty enough. It wasn't touring enough. It was just this very awkward, not made for a small person sizing. It was 5'2", you know, 120, 130 whatever pounds. And the shock and the suspension was set for a six foot or 5'10", 160 pound person. It was awful. And I only put 3,000 miles in that in three years. That's how bad it was.

Robin: Did it make you shorter? After a while, you're just like, I think I've lost a couple vertebrae.

Joanne: The only good thing about that, I mean, it was reliable, right? It was a solid, reliable vehicle and it was no problems with it. It was just from a pleasure and, you know, learning and comfort standpoint. Not for me, but it was cheap.

Robin: General overall happiness standpoint.

Joanne: Yes, I didn't want to ride it. So I didn't. But the one thing I did learn from it was how to manage a taller, heavier bike. Because before that, I was on a Ninja 250. So I went from a 28-inch seat height 250 to a 32-inch seat height, you know, 750 cc inline four that weighed another 200 pounds, you know, it was over 400 pounds. So it really taught me how to manage a higher center of gravity, a taller, heavier, terrible ergo bike. It taught me how to countersteer more because it was so bad at dropping into corners. I had to countersteer really hard. Like I felt like I was riding stretched, like something just, it was wrong. So the SV really like rocked my world. And yeah, I did all this, my first solo rides I did on that bike.

Robin: You kept that stock exhaust, which is as enormous as my bandit thing was huge.

Joanne: I did. So those photos I sent you are actually photos from the guy I bought it from.

Robin: Oh, okay.

Joanne: And the only reason I got it, because he listed it on a popular forum in the Barrier Barrier Riders forum and everybody wanted it because he was only selling it for 3000, brand new, basically 3000. The only reason I got it because technically it was his wife's bike and she didn't want it anymore. And she wanted me to have it.

Robin: Yes, yes. Well, okay, let me, let me pull you off of that and forcibly get us out of it because you're going to be gone in three minutes. Here we go. So I have some ideas for the next episode that I'm going to throw in the air for the next episode. Priority one for the first segment, obscure sport bikes that could have, would have, should have been embraced here in the US of A that we did not get, didn't get to the shores and would have been lovely.

Joanne: What if it's bikes that eventually came later, but they weren't here when we wanted them? Because I've got a list of those.

Brian: I accept. Sure. No rules. No rules here. And then Brian's got some ideas. Yeah, I saw a really interesting conversation and it's a conversation I've had in real life, but suggestions for women's gear in plus sizes. Okay. Yeah. It'd be really interesting, especially for women who are plus size, but short.

Joanne: I can do that.

Brian: That's tough to find. It's tough to fit. I've had that conversation in real life and you got women's gear, which is hard. Got a lot of things going on there at once. Yeah.

Robin: And not pink. Of course.

Brian: Well, can we get that with flowers on it? Maybe lavender? Yeah.

Joanne: No problem.

Robin: Previous host, Armandie Piper used to talk about that. She wanted to just start a company that would create gear that just wasn't pink or aqua. Please. So, all right. With that, I'm going to clock us out. Everybody, thanks for listening. Everybody ready to get out of here?

Brian: Yes. Let's haul out.