Travis: You're listening to the Riding Obsession podcast from theridingobsession.com. I'm Travis Burleson here with Robin Dean. Hello. And today we're talking about safe riding.

Robin: Spring has sprung, the grass is riz. It's time to get on it, time to get on the bikes, time to ride, time to get out there and enjoy the road. Make sure everything's ready for the entire season.

Travis: Yeah, I mean I'm heading out probably as soon as we're done recording this because it's like 60 degrees and sunny right now. It's amazing outside. Oh really? Yeah, you're in the basement, you don't know.

Robin: Well yeah, there's that. And also I kept on checking my weather today using the theridingobsession.com weather forecast page here in Libertyville. So up by you, you're faced with 60 degrees sunny and I am south of you and I'm stuck still with just below 50 degrees.

Travis: Yeah, well this says the actual temperature is 51 but the real feel is 61. Must be dank. It's mildly, we got some rain yesterday but the sun's out and it's not windy so it's very pleasant out. I was just walking the dog and having a good old time. But yeah, we're talking about safe riding. We'll get on it, stop rambling. So I think we're going to start at the beginning, right? First time riders.

Robin: Yeah, let's start with that because this is a dangerous time for even experienced riders. We are cooped up in the north for so long and once the opportunity comes to us, we get on it as fast as we can. Some of us aren't quite warmed up to the idea of it. You know, I've taken I think three rides so far this season and in fact, I'm going to have trouble keeping up today just socially because yesterday we took a long ride up north which told me everything I needed to know about how I intend on scaling things back and reassessing my understanding of riding for the rest of this season.

Travis: Yeah, we were just saying that I got on because I have a 650 single BMW and I was riding it.

Robin: Jenny the jackhammer.

Travis: Yeah, Jenny the jackhammer and I was riding it yesterday and I was just thinking, is it always this vibey or is it just because it was sitting all winter? She's in a bad mood. I think it just is, you know, you kind of forget the feel, forget the feel of it, you know, when you're not riding for three, four months. So, you know, you're definitely not going to have the control and the muscle memory that you're going to. And if you're, you know, if you're new, if this is the year that you decide to start riding, you know, there's definitely safety concerns you should have, you know, and the best place to address those is taking a training course. If you go to msf-usa.org, that's the Motorcycle Safety Foundation, you can find the closest course near you. And usually they're run by community colleges and universities in your area or different other organizations, some motorcycle organizations like Abate, depending, it varies from state to state, what kind of funding they get. But a lot of those are very cheap, 20 bucks or even free, you know, depending on where you live.

Robin: Yeah, if you're in Illinois, there's the Northern Illinois University's Motorcycle Safety Program. I'm actually about to learn to teach that program, or at least I'm going to go apply and I think they have some kind of a pre-entry qualifier of some sort. And if I can get through that, I'm going to learn to teach motorcycling just because I'd like to see more safe riding on the streets myself. And I'm definitely going to learn a thing or two. I know that NIU's program is free, there are others that are free, and you have to apply and the slots fill up pretty quick. So if you can't manage to get into that course, either way, if you have to spend the money, go ahead and do it. There are places like Ride Chicago, which I think is what, ridechicago.com?

Travis: Yeah, and the Motorcycle Riding School, that's Riding School, Riding School. That are in, but those are significantly more expensive, they're a couple hundred bucks. Where did you learn to ride? I went through Ride Chicago, Laura and I both went through Ride Chicago. Because we work wacky schedules, so we always work on the weekends. And most NIU's course is almost exclusively on the weekends. Most of the community college courses that are inexpensive or free are usually on the weekends. So it can be tough if you have a wacky schedule and you don't want to take the time off, so that's why we went with the private company.

Robin: And I think they charge what, I think it's $300 total?

Travis: Oh, who knows, you have to check the website and see, it kind of changes. And I think if you, they run specials or discounts if you do certain things, so.

Robin: Yeah, and if you even begin to think that that's a lot of money, don't. It's well worth it, they teach really well. Their entire repertoire, you learn everything you need to know about how to avoid obstacles, take turns. They hint at teaching you to be a defensive rider, which is very, very important.

Travis: Yeah, I mean, basically if you can't make the weekend courses that are put on by your local community college or there isn't one near you and you have to go through a private company and spend a couple hundred bucks, a couple hundred bucks to learn how to not kill yourself is a lot less expensive than a trip to the emergency room.

Robin: Agreed.

Travis: Or a new motorcycle, if you're just starting out and you go and you spend a couple of thousand dollars on a motorcycle and then you crash it your third day out, I mean, that's, and you wouldn't have if you'd taken the class. So that's definitely gonna be money well spent.

Robin: Yeah, speaking of which, that actually leads right into defensive motoring. I actually, I had to take a defensive motor class in high school because as a kid, as a teen driver, you know, teen drivers are always getting in all kinds of trouble. It was mandated by the state. Mandated by the state that this boy has a lead foot. Rural Ohio in the early 90s and cars and teenagers, if you got, I think, two tickets and you were under 18, then you had to take it. So I got two speeding tickets, I think once I was going maybe five over this limit. The second time I was probably going a bit faster. And so I got court mandated defensive driving or I think it was pay quintuple the fee of the ticket or something atrocious. And, you know, mom kind of stepped out of the woodwork and said, you know what, take the defensive driving class because you're gonna learn a lot. And she was right. You know, you learn how to be significantly more aware of what's going on around you. You learn just how many preemptive measures you need to consider before executing any kind of action behind the wheel of, you know, a massive vehicle. And the same things apply to motorcycling where you want to make sure that you aren't in the way of any of those threats or that you can get away from them.

Travis: Yeah, and I think all the classes do a good job of teaching you that to basically ride like you are invisible. A friend of Laurel and I, that a guy she actually used to work with when we lived in Chicago would ride his, he had an R1150, I think GS Adventure that he would ride downtown to work at a restaurant right near the loop and gave her a ride home once. And his advice was like, ride like everyone is actively trying to kill you.

Robin: Yes, everybody is targeting you and they are all fighting each other for the opportunity to end you.

Travis: I mean, not to be pessimistic or anything, but you have to ride like you're invisible. And that's just a good mindset to have. Like everyone's like, is that guy going to change lanes suddenly in front of you? Assume he is because he wants you to get hurt.

Robin: Or in Illinois, we'd say just assume he is because this is Illinois.

Travis: Yeah, if you're familiar with the region and you live in Wisconsin or Michigan, there's a term called fib that has to do with our Illinois neighbors. I'll let you figure out what it means.

Robin: Isn't there, and there's a really great restaurant called Fibs, right?

Travis: Oh, it's not a restaurant so much as it's a food cart. And yeah, in Madison, there's a food cart on the square called Fibs and it's fine Italian beefs. They have a heart-healthy Chicago fare like beefs and sausages and hot dogs.

Robin: Well, yeah, even like the most basic premise of defensive driving, if you're just even minutely self-aware, the act of properly changing lanes in and of itself, that alone is an effort towards defensive driving behavior or defensive riding. We might as well switch to that term for the sake of this podcast. The order is as follows. In Chicago or in any major city across the United States where people just don't pay any mind to etiquette or any of that, they will commence changing lanes, then halfway into the lane, check their mirror to see if they're safe, then turn on their signal, then realize they're about to smash into the person next to them, then out of control, squeal back into the other lane and then look at the person they almost hit as though it was their fault and scoff at them. That is typical of the unknowing driver or the offensive driver, let's just call it that. So offensive driving school, I would say don't pay money for it. As for defensive driving, even just a lane change, it's not that complicated. You activate your signal, you check your mirrors to make sure there's space, you confirm that that space exists by looking over your shoulder and then execute the action with caution.

Travis: Yeah, I'd say a signal, mirrors, shoulder, which I remember doing that in the class that I took, the motorcycle beginner's class. Signal first, mirror, and it's all one movement. Signal, look at your mirror, while your head's turning to your mirror, you keep going, check your shoulder, because not everything's gonna be in your mirror. And anyone who's ridden motorcycles know that most motorcycles have kind of useless mirrors. Yeah, vibrating. They're good to see if there's something right there or there's something behind you, but you can't see clearly unless you're on like a Goldwing or something that's got big, big mirrors on it. So you always wanna confirm with your eyes. And it's funny too, because that translates so well just into your everyday driving. Like I do that like every day in my car too.

Robin: Motoring is motoring, so to speak.

Travis: Yeah, and it really just makes you safer no matter what you're doing. Because yeah, there's people, I mean, this happened to me the other day where there's like this old guy driving five miles under the speed limit on the highway, and he doesn't, like, they think like if they just merge into your lane slowly enough that they don't have to signal or check their mirrors. You know, like they just kind of drift in. And if you're on a bike, like he's not gonna look. He's not gonna look, he's not gonna stop. He's assuming that he's changing lanes slowly enough that you're gonna get out of his way.

Robin: Now, there used to be a law where anybody entering the expressway had the right to merge, and I think that law is no longer.

Travis: Yeah, I mean, and at the very least, like signal. Signal, signal, signal, signal, signal, you know. And if you have like, you know, motorcycle lights aren't always the brightest lights, especially if you're on the Kennedy Expressway in Chicago and there's just a sea of lights, you know, use a hand signal, you know, and always confirm with your own eyes.

Robin: Definitely, and that's actually one of my favorite memes right now is there's a meme of Morpheus looking directly at the camera. What if I told you you're supposed to reach the same speed as other drivers before you enter the expressway?

Travis: Would you believe it? Yeah.

Robin: Yeah, you know, and even by doing that, just knowing how to change lanes correctly, you've provided yourself with more safety, and you can actually then exponentially develop that by just leaving enough space. If you provide enough distance between you and the other drivers around you, not that they're necessarily going to allow you to do that, but at least the people ahead of you, if you are able to make sure that you're not in the passing lane because you're not intending to pass, let's say you're in the lane that you should be in just to go with the flow of traffic, and you just allow enough space that you know your reaction time is going to be able to keep up with the possibilities, then you've done yourself a great service.

Travis: Yeah, definitely always try to make sure you have space. Like, I'll slow down to make sure I'm leaving enough following space, so if that guy in front of me slams on his brakes, I'm not going to eat his bumper. Or, you know, I'll speed up. Like, I'll get on it and get out of the way and get, you know, if I'm kind of stuck in someone's blind spot, you know, on multi-lanes, or like a big truck is ahead of me calling, you know, a bunch of garbage or debris and leaves, and that stuff's coming down at me, I'm going to try and get around it, or I'm going to drop back so I'm out of harm's way from that debris or out of their blind spot. You know, speed up, change lanes, slow down, make sure you have space and keep an active eye out for, can, you know, is this a dangerous place to be? Like, if that guy changes lanes, is he going to be able to see me, or am I just a sitting duck right now for him?

Robin: Yeah, I think by just considering those kinds of scenarios on a timely basis, you can't really allow yourself to just enjoy the ride until you're mindful of your environment while you're on the road.

Travis: Yeah, exactly. And then the next thing to think about, especially if you're starting, but always something to, and I want to say it's like something that if you've ever bought anything from any of the online retailers, you're reminded about daily in your inbox, is riding gear. Oh yeah, oh yeah. Spend, consumerism. Yeah, you bought a jacket last year, you need a new jacket this year.

Robin: You capitalist pigs.

Travis: But anyway, make sure that, you know, like your helmet is DOT approved, your Department of Transportation approved. Have a big sticker on the back says DOT. You know, as your helmet, if you look inside your helmet and it says novelty item, not for riding, that's not a helmet, that's a hat. That's a costume piece. You know who you are. You know who you are, but it looks cool. You know, it stops the cops from pulling you over in your helmet required state. Now where, you know, even if, you know, it's not, you don't want to wear a full face helmet, which we would both recommend wearing a full face or at least a modular helmet that has a full chin bar because they're the safest. I mean, the largest percentage of helmet damage, at least according to the Hurt Report, which is from the 80s, but it's the best, the most comprehensive existing report on motorcycle safety. The largest percentage of helmet impacts were on the face.

Robin: Do they have any diagrams for chain mail? I mean, I ride heavy. I ride heavy. You know, you can't joust without it. Motorcycle jousting, you should be safe when motorcycle jousting.

Travis: Yeah, that's where it's the full plate.

Robin: Important to note that the manufacturers are not required to label items as DOT approved. So when you look for the sticker, sometimes even the dealers will put on fraudulent stickers. Make sure you check the sticker, look at whether or not it's been tampered with, and then make sure that you maybe even look up the helmet online to find out if it is actually DOT approved. But for the most part, if you find a well-placed emblem that just states, this is a DOT approved helmet, you're good to go.

Travis: Yeah, well, too, I mean, just make sure you get a reputable helmet brand, you know, Bell, HJC. Fred's Helmets. I got your helmet designs right here in my pocket. The, I mean, you don't have, I mean, if you have the money and you want, you can spend $700 on a ShoeBirth, or $600 on an Arai, or $500 on a Shoei, but, you know, you can buy a nice HJC for 120 bucks. That's DOT or Snell approved. You can get a Bell for 120 bucks. It's DOT or Snell approved. Snell's like the next level up. Like you need a Snell for, if you would do a track day, if you go racing, you need a Snell approval. But, you know, you don't have to spend a whole lot of money. Just make sure it's a name brand and has the approval.

Robin: Those are fine brands. I mean, those are really good helmets. I've actually, I just had an interesting discussion about ShoeBirth. I don't know if this is true or not. I would like to actually find this out for myself. My wife is considering the purchase of a ShoeBirth because it's very lightweight and they're reputable.

Travis: Well, ShoeBirth is also the only company that makes a women's specific helmet.

Robin: Yeah, but the question there is they, when you, you can actually see them bow. There are a lot, there's a lot more flex. There's the question of whether or not really under a car tire, is this going to ensure that you make it out of the emergency room? There was some question about that. I'm not really prepared to say, I heard, this was one person's opinion. You know, this was one person's opinion. I didn't even know this guy. But, you know, he worked at a reputable dealer, one that I do trust, and they carry ShoeBirth and they carry Shoei and they carry all of the high-end competitors. His concern personally about that helmet was that specifically.

Travis: Yeah, well, I mean, there's, without getting too nerdy about it, there's a lot to be considered where it's like, if the helmet's too hard, what's the point of wearing the helmet? You know, if you're just, if you're wearing a concrete block on your head, it's not going to. You know, it's got to have some gives, a sort of cushion, cushioning impact there. So that's a whole, we could probably do a whole other podcast just on helmets and helmet design. Yeah, that'd be fun. We should do that. But yeah, so, you know, just make sure you get a good helmet. I mean, if nothing else, wear a helmet. If you wear nothing else, which we don't recommend, which we'll get to as our next point, wear a helmet. That's the most important piece of equipment.

Robin: Talk to me about ATGAT. What is, I'm not even familiar with this. I know I've seen it before, but I forget what it is.

Travis: Yeah, A-T-G-A-T-T, all the gear, all the time.

Robin: Yes, agreed.

Travis: I always think, what would the Stig do? And it's all the gear, all the time. Survive. Yeah, so I would say like minimal gear for me is helmet, jacket, gloves, boots.

Robin: Yeah, that's pretty good. You know, I actually wish that I, I feel a little guilty that I don't regularly protect my knees, especially because I have an external set of knee pads. You can get those for next to nothing at the local store. You can get knee pads that go on the exterior that will completely handle any kind of impact with the ground. But, you know, you got the basics right there. If your head's covered, if your upper torso is covered, and your ankles are protected, you're probably gonna be all right so long as you're riding responsibly.

Travis: Yeah, and too, I mean, I don't know, like I've ridden my bike before, like just, I was working on it in the garage, and I did a test ride around the block, and just like kept my sneakers on. And it's not pleasant to shift in sneakers, I don't know.

Robin: No, they're soft. You know, even then, it's, I've had a couple of bits where I've jumped on the bike to go up and down the block, like you said. Once I was used to wearing appropriate riding attire, it felt really, really exposed. It felt really dangerous. I didn't like it, you know? And yeah, plus I was wearing- Your van slip-ons. I was wearing my van slip-ons, and it felt like I was trying to lift barbells with my feet.

Travis: Yeah, and too, and just having that ankle support as well as the protection, like when you have to support the bike, it's just nice to have that boot on. Gloves too. I mean, if you're actually, if you're riding all day, it'll protect your hands just from blisters on the handlebars. But yeah, if you're gonna fall down, even if you're just dropping it in the parking lot, like oops, like you put the kickstand down in gravel, or like I dropped my bike the other day. I was at Culver's, and I went to go put it on the center stand, and like I hit a bump in the thing, and it rolled back off of the center stand. Oh! And it went away from me.

Robin: That's that center of gravity thing. Yeah. I was riding with some friends in Wisconsin on the Seica, my little Seica 400, which was my very first bike. And I'll tell you, it doesn't matter the size of the bike. If you break into a turn, or if you just don't quite have your body in position to handle where the weight is shifting to, you can dump anything at any speed, no matter. It's just gonna go down. I remember I was doing a U-turn because everybody had stopped to check a map, came back to them, went behind to get back in the line, made another turn, and I'm gonna guess maybe 0.5 miles an hour. And the brake locked up, and the whole bike, I wasn't even moving. I could have just put my feet down and been the tripod that would have held the bike in place. And instead, no. The center of gravity was so discombobulated that the whole thing came down.

Travis: Yeah, and if you're on asphalt, you know, like I said, even if you're in the parking lot and just like the kickstand doesn't go down right, or you catch up some loose gravel and you lose your foot and the bike tips over, you know, you're gonna fall on the ground. And the first thing that's gonna hit the ground is gonna be your hands.

Robin: Yeah, oh yeah.

Travis: And anyone who's ever fallen, if you remember being a kid and ditching your bike, or just playing kickball or whatever, and coming down hands first on gravel or asphalt, just not moving, just from your height, will tear up your hands. So just always, always wear gloves.

Robin: All that compressed energy, yeah.

Travis: Yeah, so. Did you go down with the bike? No, well, I was standing next to it and putting it on the center stand. And like the center stand didn't go, like it hit a bump on the way up. And so it didn't go all the way to lock the center stand. So it came back down. Wow. And then it went away from me.

Robin: Oh, yeah.

Travis: So there's, I mean, what am I gonna, I mean, it's a 400 pound bike. There's nothing I can, it's going away from me. I'm on the side.

Robin: Yeah, there's the sign of a defensive rider right there. If you see that much weight going down, that much weight in something that you care very much about, and you don't try to save it, you've made the right choice on a whim.

Travis: Yeah, just, I mean, it was fine. I mean, I've tipped that bike over before, but it's, you know, it's, that's the sort of stuff that happens. And like, I, you know, I've made experience, and I've put that thing on the center stand thousands of times. And, you know. Dropped it thousands of times. I've only dropped it a couple of times, but you never know. Like you never know when you're gonna lose your balance in a parking lot or on a slow maneuver and just hit the ground. So gloves, boots, helmet for riding, jacket for riding, because the jacket's gonna protect your, an actual riding jacket, you know, because it's gonna protect your insides. And if you ever see anyone who's, you know, you can go online and see pictures. You know, skin grafts are painful and expensive. Like, it'll take your skin off.

Robin: Yeah, and I do like the, you know, when we rode to Portland and back, we had our full gear on, and that included knee covers and such. And I actually have the Cedici Rapido Altimo combination. That's the jacket and the pants that go together. And it's a very sporting outfit. It's got a lot of attitude to it. It's not bulky. It's textile, so it's lightweight. It's got a completely waterproof interior liner for both the pants and the top. And it's got, I think, level two armor. Is that how that works? It's really nice. I like it a lot. It's got a lot of exterior pockets, a lot of interior pockets. It looks track day sufficient. And in fact, it is track day sufficient. So I've worn it to a track day before. It's not too Storm Trooper. No, it's not. It's not too, yeah. These aren't the droids we're looking for.

Travis: Yeah, that's another thing too about when you're talking riding gear is you don't, like if you like cruisers, you're not probably gonna want to look like a Storm Trooper when you're riding your bike. But they make Kevlar lined jeans. I have a couple pairs, and you can get this sort of stuff that has Kevlar in the knees. Do they make them in acid wash? Yeah.

Robin: Yeah, do they make them with like live to ride on the kneecaps?

Travis: Yes.

Robin: America.

Travis: You can get them however you want. But yeah, so there's, and there's Kevlar in the knees and the seat that are gonna, but they just look pretty much like jeans. Or you can, there's alternatives like the Bone Armor, B-O-H-N, Google that, where it's basically a complete armor system that you can just wear under your regular clothes.

Robin: That's what I was kind of gonna ask you about.

Travis: And they make like a regular one that's just kind of like a Lycra. I'm kind of like, it's like workout sort of material. So it stays close, it stays in place, and it keeps you cool. They make a full mesh one if it's really hot, and then they make an insulated one.

Robin: Okay, is that what you were wearing in the hotter days along our trip?

Travis: No, I was wearing, actually I was wearing a, like a dirt bike armor set underneath just a regular full mesh street jacket.

Robin: Yeah, I was actually kind of envious of that because I will say that the Cedici, it's hot. I mean, if, even when you switch to the ventilation without the liner and all of that, and you're riding at pace with wind, yeah, I mean, you cool down a lot. It's not so bad when you're moving. Actually, it's quite comfortable when you're moving. It's when you take a break and you're wearing all black or all silver, it definitely collects some heat. What you were wearing during the hotter hours, I noticed it just looked really comfortable. You had a nice mesh, fully breathable jacket on with the armor underneath. And what exactly were those brands in total? Because I might actually buy that exact setup.

Travis: Oh, the jacket, I wouldn't recommend. It's a cheap jacket. I know, I think Cycle Gear has their full mesh jacket on sale right now, if you want to check that out. I think it's a little better quality. The armor, I'd have to look. It's actually like dirt bike armor. It's not CE rated, but I mean, it's pretty heavy duty. Might be Fox Racing. It's not Fox brand. It's, I got it from a motorcycle superstore.

Robin: Oh yes, we love that in the Midwest. If you buy from motorcycle superstore, now, unfortunately, their affiliate links don't work with our site, which I really wish they did. I'm gonna have to contact them about that. But if you order from motorcycle superstore in the Midwest and it's before 1 p.m., that's a next day delivery. It's like free overnight because they're in the area.

Travis: Yeah, I think their distribution center's in like Indiana or Southern Wisconsin. Yeah, so, yeah, I mean, there's options out there. Or just, you know, get a nice, you know, mesh. There's different options out there. And actually, we'll talk about that a little later when we talk about cold weather and hot weather riding.

Robin: Yeah, which brings me up to another point. Now, here you are, a new rider, and you've put on all of your armor. Taken the class. You've taken the class and you're all set. Now, you know how to ride a motorcycle. So, you went out and you bought yourself a 15-foot chopper. A Hayabusa, a Hayabusa, a Hayabusa. And then you removed all the signals and, you know, got a fender eliminator. Put a NOS bottle in the back to look cool. NOS bottle, stretch swing arm. Stretch swing arm and it's a chopper. So, you've got a chopper Hayabusa with a stretch swing arm.

Travis: Yeah, or you just bought.

Robin: It's a beautiful machine. Just elegant, sign of true class. And now you're ready to ride.

Travis: Yeah, or you bought a Goldwing or a brand new $28,000 BMW K1600.

Robin: You've discovered that the size and CCs will purely and accurately detail just what kind of an adult you are. So, you've gotten as many CCs as possible and you're gonna go as fast as possible in one direction for as long as you can. I'm telling you right now, you're not gonna get very far.

Travis: Yeah, like buying a Gixxer, a Suzuki GSX-R 600, you think, oh, 600, that's like a midsize bike. No, it's a race replica bike.

Robin: That's built for out the gates MotoGP racing.

Travis: I rode, yeah, I rode my friends once and down River Road out of Des Plaines. And I was like, oh, yeah, okay, whatever, like not it, you know? And then I looked at the speedometer, I was doing 80. Yeah. Like didn't realize it.

Robin: Yeah, second gear. Second gear, 80 miles an hour. This is not the bike for you from the start. You will get there. And when you have become a balanced rider who understands both yourself and what you want from motorcycling, you know, that takes a little bit of time. If you have some idea of what you're after, that's fine, but make sure you get it within the parameters of what you can handle.

Travis: Yeah, I mean, there's definitely, especially right now, if you're willing to go for like a newer bike and you want a sport bike, I mean, there's the CBR 300 or the 250 from the Kawasaki 300. Yamaha just released a new R300 or R3. Like that's a mean machine. And that thing's pretty quick, but it's not R6 quick.

Robin: Yeah, and it's like, we're sitting here right now talking about it. I've got a 1200 in the garage. You've got the 650 single. We've got touring bikes. I would love to have one of those little bikes just to rip around on and get to know, you know what I mean?

Travis: Yeah, for sure. I mean, and they're just fun to ride and they're easy to handle. Or, you know, if you're a cruiser type, like don't go and buy a fat boy, don't go buy a big 1200, one, you know, big, cause those bikes are heavy and they're tricky to handle. You know, if you don't know what you're doing, you know, go out, Kawasaki just came out with the new Vulcan S. You know, or if you're small enough, cause it's a small bike, the Honda Rebel. That was my first bike.

Robin: Honda Rebel's a great bike.

Travis: That's a great bike. And both our wives have a Nighthawk, which is like a standard version of it. They stopped making it in 2008, same motor. And we love riding those bikes.

Robin: Yeah, those, I have a lot of fun on that. We just put some new Avon Road Riders on there. She's actually taking it to track day. But that brings me to another point is that, you know, you look at a bike like the Nighthawk, it is a simple machine that requires little to no maintenance. It is a standard profile, which I think we should talk about the different profiles in a moment here. And it doesn't take up much space and it'll tell you everything you want to know about yourself as a rider before you decide which direction you're going to go in terms of which profile fits you.

Travis: Yeah, one, two, and that's something to consider and make sure when you get that bike, that it's, you know, don't go to the other side of the spectrum and go so practical that you don't want to ride it.

Robin: Yeah, there's that.

Travis: Don't get something that's like, oh, well, you know, this was rated by Cycleworld as the best beginner bike and it's a crotch rocket. You know, you got a CBR 250, you know, so it looks like a sport bike. And, you know, you want to be a cruiser and all your friends ride cruisers, you know, go, no, like go get a cruiser, but just think about it. You know, there's some cruisers out there that are a better place to start than like a fully loaded electric glide.

Robin: Yeah, riders beginning to advanced, we all got into this for similar reasons to some extent. And part of that reason is in terms of maybe a little bit of image and what appeals to us, what is aesthetically pleasing in our minds. You should be able to lean in that direction without going so far as to putting your own riding ability in jeopardy.

Travis: Yeah, especially if, like I said, if you're willing to go newer, the manufacturers have really caught on to that in the last, you know, five to eight years, I'd say, and have really pushed out a bunch of really affordable bikes for beginning riders. And, you know, a lot of deals, I remember where I got my bike through Des Plaines Honda and they had a deal where like if within a year I traded, I bought it new, I bought my Honda Rebel new. And if I traded it in within a year and trade it up, I would get full purchase price on the trade-in.

Robin: That's incredible.

Travis: Yeah, so I mean, you know, if you're going to a dealer, you know, see if they'll do something like that. So, you know, put your miles on that first season, you know, get your skill set up and then trade up and see what, you know, see what they'll do for you.

Robin: Yeah, and moreover, it also is a sign of faith in their own product. They're basically saying we sell bikes that we know you're going to bring back. And even if it's even slightly damaged, we can build it back up and sell it. That bike will run forever. So you find a deal like that, take them up on it. But within, again, within the parameters of what you're interested in. You know, another thing to think about now, I know Travis, this is actually one of your notes. And I admire you for putting this in here, especially since I know that you have a little bit of a thing for oddities. You like strange bikes. The bike that you ride, you know, we've seen a couple of them. They're definitely out on the road. They're not unobtainium, but you like interesting and different kinds of bikes. And so that's not necessarily for everyone. When you do get a motorcycle, you want to consider that how much of a wrench are you? Think about maintenance and reliability.

Travis: Yeah, exactly. The, you know, we're talking about my eclectic taste because I'm drooling over like a 2008 Buell I really want to get right now. It's like, oh yeah, you know, where like the oil goes into the swing arm and the gas goes into the frame. It's different. It's different. And my bike, you know, too, we talk about my BMW. When I change the oil, I need to take out three. Three? Three different places. Yeah, I need to train the oil from three different places. And it's not the worst thing. It's just, you need to know how to do it. And it's kind of tedious. And if that's not your style, you know, there are simpler bikes out there.

Robin: Yeah, that's no big deal. I've had motorcycles that drained oil from three different places all at the same time, all the time.

Travis: That's a different sort of maintenance and reliability issue. Yeah, well, it's like the, we're talking about our, both our wives have a Nighthawks. Love it. And that's, it's such a bulletproof engine. It doesn't, it's air cooled. It doesn't have an oil filter even. You know, I just did the fork oil on it and it has a fork oil drain. So you don't have to take the forks off to drain and replace the fork oil. It's got drum brakes. So you don't have to mess with brake fluid. It's really like the easiest bike on the wind world to work on. And, you know, it's a great place to start. So think about that too. Or if you, you know, if you're into sport bikes, you want to get a sport bike, how much plastic is on it and how much plastic are you going to have to take off every time you want to lube the chain or change the oil?

Robin: If you get a bike with any kind of a fairing up front, there's usually going to be some kind of a, a little bit of a tedious operation to removing it. You know, for like my bandit, I got to unscrew four bolts up top, remove the windshield, then four more bolts behind, pull the entire bridge, and then the side panels in the front. It sounds like a lot. I've gotten used to it. But then again, that's not necessarily for everybody. And a lot of people just appreciate the naked bikes for the fact that they're brass tax motorcycles.

Travis: Yeah, exactly. Well, I know, and there's some, there's a lot of, you know, Yamaha just came out with the SR400. That's like basically a bike from the seventies with fuel injection, you know, air-cooled singles, simple, you know, simple machines like that. You know, even, you know, there's just, there's, it's something to think about is how complex is this going to be? And that brings us kind of to our next point here, just about safety is keeping your bike, you know, mechanically sound, you know, inspecting your bike before you ride, just giving it a once over, make sure the tires are, make sure the tires are filled up. Is it leaking anything? Does it, you know, is it making a funny sound?

Robin: Yeah, if you, if you walk around the motorcycle and you see anything that seems off put, and it just doesn't seem right to you, even as a beginner, you'll, you'll notice something. Sometimes they just tell you that I don't feel comfortable with that. You know, you've, then you've made the right choice.

Travis: You know, making sure you're up on the maintenance too, you know, changing the oil on time, making sure you do it every year, you know, regardless of how many miles you put on, making sure your brake fluid gets changed when it's supposed to, fork oil, make sure your batteries charge, make sure all your lights work.

Robin: This gets into an interesting point in that there's a lot to keep track of. And, you know, personally, guys like us, we keep our manuals by our toilet and we know the manuals, we've searched through them repeatedly. We are familiar with the oil stains from fingerprints from when we were doing the last task and their dog ears all have their own little code. But the truth of the matter is, I just finished putting in a couple of weeks effort coding a maintenance record system for everybody to use if they want to sign up for it. We don't, we don't take your email address or do anything with it, unless you want to sign up for the newsletter, which is an option, it's unchecked. But if you sign up for that feature, you can store all of your maintenance information in that system so that you update the mileage and it tells you what is approaching, what needs to be done, when, how much further you have, that sort of thing. You know, for some of these bikes, there's a lot of little things. I know that of the three that I have, strangely enough, the one that takes the most maintenance is my Hawk GT. It's got a long list of procedures that need to be done on a timely basis, a strange little bike. But now, courtesy of this system, I've got all of my procedures and tasks and to-do lists and torque values and all of that is stored in my username account under my maintenance records in the members area. So be sure and check out the site. And if you look at the top right in the navigation, you'll see a section that says Members. Click on it, sign up, put it to use, and have at it. I'm open to suggestions about any way we might better it. And I look forward to that developing for the better of all of us.

Travis: Yeah, and if, like, kind of keeping on the theme of beginning, but even if you've been riding, you know, and if you just take your bike to the dealer every time and you don't really know, you know, ask them if you can sit there. You know, if you have the afternoon free, ask them if you can sit in the shop and watch them do it. See, ask them some questions. You know, or find a mechanic that will show you that'll show you how to do it or someone who's mechanically inclined that works on their bike and just go help them work on it and learn how to do those things yourself. Because it's really one of those things that I think everyone should at least know how to do, even if, for convenience, you pay someone to do it, is, you know, change your oil and check everything and make sure it's good.

Robin: That's something that I have a personal connection with and that, you know, I've started late and I just really enjoy when I hear new information and maybe I can't quite grasp it at first, but I have an opportunity to at least hear it and slowly make the connection, sometimes embarrassingly slow, but eventually it sinks in. So now, you know, for example, now I can check my valves now. I know how to do that. Always go where the know-how is, especially if you trust your dealer. And usually they're happy to work on your bike. They sold it to you. That's a relationship with them that is to your advantage.

Travis: And we can, you know, kind of get out of the realm of beginner-ness. Though, I mean, you know, knowing how to work on your bike isn't necessarily a beginner thing. I think that should be for everyone. But like if we're out on the road, you know, let's be, you know, be ready for the unexpected. Be ready for everything. Be ready for everything. So it's always good to have like a toolkit. You're just a little roadside toolkit to fix little things that, I mean, you know, a crescent wrench, a screwdriver, if nothing else. You know, if something comes loose out on the road, you want to be able to tighten it. You don't want a loose bolt to strand you when it's so easy to fix.

Robin: Yeah, and we have a little bit of an overkill page for that as well. I try to take as many tools as I could and compress them down to the most minimalist package as possible. Take it or leave it. A little bit of it, all of it, whichever. There's a page on the site for that under the maintenance link at the top. Just go to maintenance and then roadside toolkit. I usually take all of that, believe it or not.

Travis: Yeah, and it kind of depends too. Like when we did our big trip, you know, I had a tool roll that I could pretty much disassemble my bike with. You know, I had, and I specialize, you know, I didn't have a whole socket set. I don't need a whole socket set. I needed a 10 millimeter, a 12 millimeter, and a 17 millimeter. You know, I didn't need a whole set of wrenches. I only needed a couple. I needed a torque set and a hex set and that's it. And that will take care of pretty much anything. I mean, could I do like a full disassembly, reassemble? No, but I could. Take the head off. Yeah, I could tighten things that would get loose. I could change the oil if I had to, you know, just some basic stuff. And yeah, everyday riding, there's like a couple, there's like the toolkit that came with the bike, which has like three wrenches and a torque set.

Robin: Yeah.

Travis: And that's pretty much good for like anything that might come loose on a day-to-day basis. I know a lot of new motorcycles don't come with any, when I got my, when I had bought that Honda, it came with a screwdriver. So you could like take off the side cover and see the battery. Yeah. And so it's always worth, you know, especially the more you get to know your bike, which is a good thing about working on it is you kind of get to know like, oh, like this, this thing comes loose or needs adjustment fairly regularly, you know, or, oh, everything on this bike is a 12 millimeter hex. So like you can just throw a 12 millimeter wrench and now like you can fix half your bike with that one tool. So usually most bikes are fairly simple. Where that works.

Robin: Yeah. And the process of trying to find compact versions of those tools is I think part of the magic. If you can find anything that combines anything into one, I use a multi-tool and you have a multi-tool as well that that's come in handy more than one time. And it really, mine holds 40 tools in the palm of my hand that actually function as they're intended. Is that the Gerber or is it a Leatherman? It's the Leatherman Wave with the extra bit set, which fits right next to it. It's got it all right there.

Travis: Yeah. And then another thing to think about too is just, you know, high-vis, which I think I'll mention a couple of times here.

Robin: Yeah. Yeah. Well, you're a BMW rider.

Travis: Yeah, high-vis and just a flashlight. Like if you're riding at night and you get stuck at the side of the road, I mean, people get hit at the side of the road all the time. So make sure you have something reflective to wear or at least like set by the road so people can see you in a flashlight so you can see what you're doing and you make yourself visible or signal with it. Like I bought, I don't even know where I got it. You can pick it up. I got this like Rayovac LED, runs off a couple of AA's and that thing is a mini sun in the palm of your hand. It's indestructible. Like you can ride, you can run it over with a car and it's fine.

Robin: They also make some that you can shake and then kick on.

Travis: Yeah, and it's, you know, it was like 50, I picked up at like the checkout at like Farm and Fleet. It was like 15 bucks, you know? So just get one of those little, you know, get a nice little LED flashlight and throw it in your tank bag or throw it under your seat, you know, check it every now and again to make sure the batteries are good, make sure that it works and, you know, forget about it till you need it.

Robin: Yeah.

Travis: You'll, because the day will come when you're like on some back country road and your headlight goes out or something weird happens and you need to like, oh, that was a weird sound. I just want to check and make sure that bolt didn't come loose and it's dark.

Robin: Yeah, and when you talk about batteries, that's also another reason to make sure you check your gear along with the mechanical inspection every now and then. Pull the tool kit open and make sure anything that's battery operated or needs to be assembled still has all of what's necessary to operate properly.

Travis: Yeah, make sure you're, you know, if you have a socket, a ratchet, make sure it hasn't rusted stiff or anything.

Robin: Yeah, I like what you got here with the parking lot and the practice.

Travis: Yeah, I mean, especially, I mean, new or old, I mean, you know, go, if you haven't been riding all winter, you know, go find a big empty parking lot and just do some panic stops, you know, do, you know, get some little cones or just like find some rocks and make some little cone markers and do some swerves and do all that stuff you learned and the basic safety course.

Robin: Yeah, rock some figure eights and rock some right angles and avoid the bus, avoid the bus.

Travis: Yeah, do some slow turns, you know, just get the feel of the bike back. Cause like I was saying at the beginning, get, I got back on my bike this, you know, this year and every year, and I know it happens every year and it just feels unfamiliar. You know, just like the thousands of miles I put on that bike, it just feels foreign cause I haven't done it in so long. So it's always a good idea. And just like, even in the middle of the season, the end of the season, you know, do some practice or, you know, don't stop your learning, you know, if take an advanced rider course.

Robin: Yeah, that's something I've got to do. I'm so looking forward to this class. I know that you and I were talking about maybe doing a podcast about total control, which, you know, unfortunately I'm at a disadvantage where I've learned a lot from people who teach that class, the total control course. And yet the actual dialogue, the actual terminology is not there. I cannot make the words about total control. It's an amazing class. That's one example of many really great advanced riding courses that, except I think the one you're speaking of specifically is a different animal. What's that one all about?

Travis: Oh yeah, just from basically from the beginning where we're talking about the MSF beginner course, they do an intermediate and advanced rider's course, all sorts of courses if you check out the website. So a lot of the places that do the beginning rider course do an advanced rider course where you bring your own bike and, you know, it's usually a day, it's usually less expensive. And you, you know, it's, they teach you how to handle better, how to brake better, how to be aware and be safe and be a defensive driver. And it's, and even if you've done it before, like, you know, do it every year or two or just to, just to refresh and just to keep it in your mind and to keep your skills sharp. You know, you get, you get complacent, you get comfortable and it's just a good place to go and keep, keep those skills sharp. Another alternative you can do is, you know, there's a lot of reading material out there. Anything you might have from, from MSF courses or any other practice or learning courses you've taken. You know, if you have those books or pamphlets sitting around, just, you know, dust them off and flip through them. And you might be like, oh yeah, that's right. Like that's the, that was that one thing that didn't quite, wasn't logical to me, but made a lot of sense when I read it. And I totally forgot about it. Now it makes sense. Or the one I recommend is David L. Hough, H-O-U-G-H's Proficient Motorcycling. And there's a couple of sequels to that too, like More Proficient Motorcycling. But just those books are really great. He really breaks down control and hazard and risk management in a very approachable sort of narrative way. His writing style is very, it's not like reading a manual.

Robin: Yeah, nice.

Travis: It's just like having a conversation with like an old guy who knows more than you. And he's got these great diagrams that really explain, you know, like delayed apex turning and how to handle center of gravity and off camber road conditions. And, you know, just a guy who's been an educator and has tons of experience. And any of those books are just fantastic.

Robin: I think I actually have a copy of that upstairs. I think my friend Neil Sullivan, I think he loaned me that book. I can't say for sure.

Travis: But yeah, I mean, that's, I mean, one of the things he talks about there, just on the continuing theme of safety, you know, blind corners, the road isn't a racetrack. You know, I mean, we like to go out and hit some country roads and do twisties and go fast-ish and have fun, you know, ride swiftly.

Robin: Responsibly aggressive is my favorite term of the year. And yeah, it's spirited, but mostly I take my cues from, again, older riders who are still with us who say, you know, it's not about the speed, it's about the style and form.

Travis: Yeah, and that's it. The road isn't, if you really want to get a knee down, go to a racetrack. The road is not the place for that.

Robin: And the racetrack is the safest place to do that. It is not, hey, I'm going to the racetrack. It's not, you're not telling anybody in your family I'm going to jump into a fire pit. You're going to a place where the pavement is maintained, better than any road, paramedics are on site. You have to have the specified armor to even touch the pavement there. And you're going to be learning about how to handle your bike even better.

Travis: Yeah, and if you do lay it down, there's a runoff, there's a gravel trap, there isn't a truck coming the other way. Yeah, you can ride into oncoming traffic without any oncoming traffic existing. Yeah, so it's really, and that's the difference too. I mean, we're talking probably one of the most dangerous things is going to be a blind corner, which out here in Wisconsin, I like to ride in the Driftless, which is an amazing region. But what makes the roads so fun to ride is that it's a really hilly country, it's hill country. So there's just rolling hillocks, maybe about six to 800 feet. So you can't build a road in a straight line. But the problem with swerving around hills is there's always a hill on one side of you.

Robin: It's a real shock value when you hit a blind corner and you know for a fact that you've come in too hot, too late.

Travis: I mean, I wouldn't recommend going above the recommended speed for a corner unless you've been through that corner before.

Robin: There you go. If you've seen it before, if you know it, for example, and even then, why push if you could just do it on a track day where you enter a corner so hard that you're going to have to bring the bike as low as possible to get through the turn. The fear you feel doing something like that, it's not the kind of adrenaline that you get addicted to. It's the kind of feeling where you realize that you do have a lot more to learn and that it's time to start learning it.

Travis: Thank you for joining us here on the Riding Obsession podcast from theridingobsession.com. I'm Travis Burleson. And I'm Robin Dean. And we'll see you next time.

Robin: Later, folks.